Post Archive
Region: Greater Sahara
Maybe we could put citizenship behind an application form which is run by the Delegate and their part of the government?
I was thinking we could have the delegate be the head of the executive branch and then we could also elect a legislative branch to keep the delegate in check as well as pass our own laws/resolutions. Though I wonder if the number for WA is lower because of puppets? From what I've read on the forums and FAQ using the WA is the only real unique identifier in the game natively and so total WA compared to total nations would always be low because of people who have more than their first nation.
Wert
5 endorsements seem a little too high rn as only around 7-8 people in the region are in the WA
I think we shouldn't grant automatic citizenship at all to be honest, foreigners could still come in and just go through that process to effect our elections.
Wert
You were saying citizenship is granted if you endorse the delegate; since thats albeit a bit impossible while simultaneously planning on having in-game built delegate elections, what if we had a council of trusted people, like 3, a committee of trusted people, as WA candidates, and youd need to endorse at least one of them but which one and how many is up to you, to still give you a choice in which one to endorse?
Wert, Lave Deldederady
I dont think citizenship shouldnt be too complicated though, and not locked too much behind WA
Wert
3 seems too much, maybe two but i do like that idea though
Acornesia
Maybe we can allow candidates to announce their campaign and then citizens endorse who they want to be the new delegate? To be able to campaign you have to already be a trusted citizen? or we can make candidates only from our government so we already know they are trusted?
Would we want the delegate to have full power in appointing some type of Minister or would we want them to be elected on their own? Appointed but confirmed by vote of the legislature - if we have one?
If you guys don't mind I could take a stab at writing out something in legal speak as a sort of constitution?
Acornesia, Wert
Also, I know this wouldnt be the most democratic solution, and maybe not even most efficient solution, but I feel like it could be fun to have the other elected position other than delegate be elected by a two step process instead of one step. I dont really have a reason for this, but it could be more secure.
For example, everyone gets to vote for a bunch of candidates who are running to be Electors (name just a concept). The top 5 people by votes, are added as Electors, and then they vote among themselves for the candidate of head of legislative branch.
Wert, Lave Deldederady
Unless we have a better way to have a unique identifier for each nation I think the WA is our best bet to keep people from tricking us via more than one nation in the region or otherwise being a puppet state of another nation which intends to cause harm.
Wert
Sure, but lets try and get the basics fleshed out first.
I would think instead of delegate appointing ministers, we would have the legislative branch appoint ministers. Or maybe the delegate gets to appoint 2 ministers, and the legislative appoints the other 2, or something
Wert
I don't hate that either, though we could easily just make it Parliament. So we have 3 or 5 (odd numbers) Members of Parliament and among themselves they elect our President/Delegate/Prime Minister as well as a Speaker to run Parliament. Then everything the President/Delegate/Prime Minister does can be voted on by Parliament or they can be impeached as needed. That type of stuff.
Theres little difference between delegate elections and legislative elections aside from electoral process, if is the same people that are allowed to vote.
I think we go with https://www.nationstates.net/page=rmb/postid=51849075 this parliament idea, to be honest. Now that I am thinking it over I am liking it more and more as it allows us to have a trusted group controlling things which we can keep to unique citizens.
Acornesia
Honestly, due to the delegate being elected completely automatically by in game mechanics and not manually like other parts of the political system, Id say wed be a Presidential Republic, in that the legislative does not have the ability to impeach the delegate/executive branch.
Wert
I think for now, the idea of a parlament is too much as most payers in the region are issues players. i think we could think to "ministers" for now
I am about to head to class in a few minutes, I'll mull over some of this and try writing something out to show what I am thinking. I'll post it when I get a chance. Think about the Parliament idea and using a discord though, I really think those are our better bets.
Wert
Parliament will give them something to do
Presidential republic works for me, no impeachments would be fine as well though maybe we could allow Parliament to call an impeachment referendum and if the citizens pass it then the Vice President is in charge? (Vice President could also be the second place winner of the Presidential election?)
Wert
I dont think a parliment is right for this region, there is simply too many people in this region that do not care what region they are in and are just issues players, but i think a discord would be good
Okay, so heres the idea that Im getting right now, more or less:
Delegate - Head of State and the Executive Branch. Elected automatically by in game mechanics, barrin foreigners who will have an endorsement cap to try and prevent this.
Prime Minister/Chancellor (name pending) - Head of Government and Legislative Branch. Elected by the Electors/Parliament
Electors/Parliament - Legislative Branch, the top 3/5 electors with the most votes in the electoral campaign will become electors. The electors will then review the list of Prime Minister/Chancellor candidates and vote on which one.
Wert
i think instead of a parliament, it should be ministers chosen by the prime minister, who is chosen by the people. the delegate would have slightly more powers than a minister but not as much as the PM
I think elections should be done in the region. Even if they are riggable, slightly, I think strict citizenship programs, though not downright elitist, are enough to prevent mass rigging. And, as this is a Presidential Republic, the most secure position of Delegate will always have more power than the less secure position, so it is ultimately not the end of the world if we get some Electors and Chancellors who are foreign puppets or whatever
I disagree, I think itd be fun and more secure to have it the other way around. Instead of the bottom electing the top which appoints the middle, the bottom elects the middle which appoints the top.
Wert
It doesnt matter if we have tons of members who simply answer issues and couldnt care less about our complicated government. They will always have that as an option, and its more for them to do
Lave Deldederady
but that also makes it more confuseing, look at some regions like The North Pacific, and The Order Of The Grey Wardens TNP even has some of the highest WA activity becuase of it!
Its that confusing for the legislative to vote on the head of the legislative. Its also more secure, in my opinion
Wert
https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=1868933
I wrote this dispatch before leaving for class, I can get into more details of it on my lunch hour or when I get home. I am very excited to be able to be here and help begin this region with you guys, though. I hope I am able to help out and maybe even become delegate one day (if elected, of course!)
Acornesia, Wert
a parliament can also be too chaotic, IF we do end up doing a legeslative branch it should be something more simpler
3 electors who pick a Chancellor from a bunch of candidates for Chancellor is pretty simple
Wert
I do like the house of reps, or something like that being a legeslative branch, but i dont like the delegate being the president at the same time, that give the delegate too much power
The delegate is head of state
Wert
3?!? i swear you said more than that earlier, three seems fine, but i feel like we shouldn't change the electors too many time
true but it should not have so much power over the government itself! the delegate should choose the electors, while the president chooses ministers
Acornesia
also once a month is way too often
and political parties.... I completely disagree with having them.
Acornesia
President is just the term I was calling for the Delegate, if the delegate has so much power already we elect them this way. President = Delegate. Delegate/President is Head of State and Head of Government (like in the USA).
Once a month was just a random timeframe I pulled out of my behind since I don't know what would be good - maybe 3 months? Political parties aren't something I would want either but I think no matter what we are going to have political groups form, we might as well make sure they are treated fairly.
Acornesia, Wert
https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=1868935
This is my idea
I said 5 earlier but that might be too much
Wert
Also we should open an embassy thread in the forums
Wert
Of the two suggestions, i do likeAcornesia's one more
Yall have sent 77 RMB messages, why dont you just have the delegate have all the power, it seems to work well in The Pacific and The West Pacific
Acornesia, Wert
Since the delegate has so much power in the game they could just ignore the laws and the Head of Government - that is why I think the Delegate should be a regulated Head of State instead of being elected just whenever somebody gets the most endorsements. Part of the regulation is the endorsement caps.
that seems a bit too extreme
Northern Wardorsinatinady
I made us a discord group: https://discord.gg/US8h8RnH
Endorsement caps only on foreigners. If the delegate ignores all the laws, then the Legislative will make an announcement to everyone to withdraw their endorsements, but if the people dont withdraw their endorsements, ultimately its a de-facto dictatorship
Wert
But its a frontier region, the delegate is the equivalent a
'founder' in stronghold regions
Acornesia
I dont think elections should be held there, though.
I cant use discord right now so Ill get around to joining later.
I do like that idea quite a bit
Acornesia
Yeah so we should create the laws to try and not have that happen
Okay so our laws should be mostly about how to stop that from happening
Acornesia, Wert
that limits the government's power too much
There is no way to fully enforce any constitution we make. The delegate has de-facto absolute power, even if they dont de-Jure.
Yes like how endo caps on foreigners to prevent a raid from couping us.
But ultimately a native coup is on the cards. And I dont dislike the idea of occasional constitutional dictatorships forming that much anyway
Right so we legislate and create systems around it like they do in larger frontiers like the North Pacific, they seem pretty democratic.
It doesn't limit anything to create a law which elects the delegate through citizenship rather than allowing anybody to just become delegate and enforce their will upon the region.
I gotta do something rq irl ill brb in like 15 minutes
Sure but I feel like when creating our regional government we shouldn't have the aim of a dictatorship at the start, it can happen but if it happens it should be because of abuse of a legal system or something, I guess.
It's okay, my ride is here so I will be back later.
I dont have the goal of a dictatorship, but I think the delegate should be elected via game mechanics, not by a different system.
Wert
hi
Acornesia, Wert
Hello! Welcome!
Wert, Absolute Samiesser
that is a good idea. i think game mechanics would definitely be the best way to determine a delegate.
Acornesia
We can still restrict the election of foreign delegates with endorsement caps on non-citizens like I originally proposed
Wert
your idea the more i think about it sounds like it would be the best fit for the region
Smh y'all missing out on a good idea fr fr. also you all have filled 2/3rds of the RMB with arguing THATS A LOT OF ARGUING . your region probably gonna get RAIDED!!! :P
WHY AM GETTING MANY TELEGRAM?
Its okay! Open telegrams, press preferences, and disable recruitment.
Its not arguing its talking about our future
Wert, Laosball
we wont get raided. also we are getting closer to determining a government are we will continue to discuss about it in the RMB as long as needed
Im going to already make a factbook list of citizens even if we havent sorted out the details of who gets it and who doesnt
Wert
Thats a good idea
The WA update is very soon. We need to watch very carefully for when the update arrives, because thats when theres gonna be raiders, if at all
Wert
Also, shouldnt we maybe consider joining some alliances? Im not sure exactly on the process of joining and the benefits, but we should look into it
Wert
Getting embassies with other regions could be helpful as we could ask them for assistance if we ever get raided
Were safe for the WA update!
Wert
I managed to get one of my friends to make a NationStates account and join the region
Hopefully we survive the next one as well
THANK YOU
If I can't be WA Delegate can I at least get an officer role called "The Wall Builder" who stops raiders coming in
Wert
i can only give one border control power every 24 hours as this is a new region and the game wont let me :/
Astarter
Bruh
Wert
Hello everyone!
Wert
Hello! Welcome to Greater Sahara!
Inner Kilvaka
Hey I'm Astarter, since there's no other cool regions I decided to put this alt here, it's just gonna be for some alt history factbooking so I won't be a bother.
Wert
Well hello!
I'm back i hope i can contribute as much as i can in this region.
Sorry for leaving.
Wert
Welcome back! we're glad to have you back!
Rainbowstaria
Hello! I'm brand new to this. Am I stuck with a random country's flag or this default one?
Wert
Hey! Site was really slow for a while there. Made me think it was my internet.
Wert
Check this page amigo
https://www.nationstates.net/page=upload_flag
upload it with saved images or downloaded ones only png, svg, jpeg and gif format is available
Wert, Inner Kilvaka
Oh wow! Thanks!
Wert, Rainbowstaria
what's good everyone
Wert
Thanks for the warm welcome! How're you doing?
Wert, Rainbowstaria
Im doing fine could be better but for the moment everythings going how it should be
thanks for asking
Wert, Inner Kilvaka, Lave Deldederady
Trying to figure out how to make a flag somewhere
Sure thing :) glad you're doing alright
Rainbowstaria
Go to an image right click and save it when you click the image it will be stored in archives or use a flag creator like these
https://flag-creator.com/
https://tennessine.co.uk/flags/
Wert, Lave Deldederady
im doing fine. hbu?
Rainbowstaria, Inner Kilvaka
I am back, how is everyone? Was a consensus reached in the issue of our governance?
Wert, Rainbowstaria
Doing pretty good, thanks for asking
Wert, Lave Deldederady
i ended up thinking that Acornesia's idea would be best for the region
Remind me what that was? I think I missed a lot of backstory
Wert, Lave Deldederady
https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=1868935
https://imgur.com/a/gFtRYWx
heres my take on the flag i hope you like it
Wert, Test123334
I like that flag design quite a bit!
Rainbowstaria
Its everything intended although i didnt want to go all out considering it would be a mess if i did
i mean just look at my flag
Wert
I'm not sure about having two different election seasons - wouldn't it be simpler to hold a legislator vote whenever we get a new delegate?
Acornesia, Wert, Lave Deldederady
Assembled with Dot's Region Saver.
Written by Refuge Isle.