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Region: Lands End

History

Anyone know the regions that have region parliaments? Maybe it would be in the best interest of LE to create one.

The Democracy Of Red Star

Or at least a chamber of commerce to advise on compliance, loopholes, profit making, and to lobby (amplify our delegate's voice)

Also,

Are we making any progress on finding potential appointees for senior management positions? Are we all clear on whose responsibility that is? Is there anyone wanting to contribute little more to LE and is not sure Who to contact?

The Cincinnatus Republic, Legoa, International Settlements

Buryasia wrote:Or at least a chamber of commerce to advise on compliance, loopholes, profit making, and to lobby (amplify our delegate's voice)

Also,

Are we making any progress on finding potential appointees for senior management positions? Are we all clear on whose responsibility that is? Is there anyone wanting to contribute little more to LE and is not sure Who to contact?

I wouldn't know if I'm qualified for anything.

The Democracy Of Red Star, International Settlements

If you want to do something, we can talk about possibilities including recruiting, pr, office manager where you probably just copy new names into the old office layout. It's very important to step up a little bit now so that if we ever need to replace a board member there are people in LE who've already learned a few things. But you don't have to train all the way up to become my future replacement, just find a way to help. GT, anyone, wanna add to this thought?

The Democracy Of Red Star, Legoa

The Democracy Of Red Star wrote:Fine .... I’m back

I'm glad, why did you leave exactly? What really confuses me is why you left to The Pacific.

International Settlements

Peacockastan wrote:I'm glad, why did you leave exactly? What really confuses me is why you left to The Pacific.

I sent you a telegram, again I apologize.To the rest LE I wasn’t was wasn’t paying Attention to LE News ( I normally don’t) so I went to the Pacific to hang with a friend.then well I got a telegram from Peacockastan well the rest is a short history.

Peacockastan

I need a ambassador. Anyone TG me if they want to be one.

The Democracy Of Red Star

Buryasia wrote:If you want to do something, we can talk about possibilities including recruiting, pr, office manager where you probably just copy new names into the old office layout. It's very important to step up a little bit now so that if we ever need to replace a board member there are people in LE who've already learned a few things. But you don't have to train all the way up to become my future replacement, just find a way to help. GT, anyone, wanna add to this thought?

I'd be willing to give office/building manager a try since I wanted to get involved with that anyway.

Buryasia, The Democracy Of Red Star

Buryasia wrote:Or at least a chamber of commerce to advise on compliance, loopholes, profit making, and to lobby (amplify our delegate's voice)

Also,

Are we making any progress on finding potential appointees for senior management positions? Are we all clear on whose responsibility that is? Is there anyone wanting to contribute little more to LE and is not sure Who to contact?

Can I have aid finding a ambassador? I know I’ll need one.

The Democracy Of Red Star, International Settlements

Grater, I want to apologize for the double TG. My device is currently being stubborn as I previously mentioned. I am willing to resign if needed.

The thing in the WA seems stupid. What's the point in regulating all of these pollutants to such an extreme amount for the sake of groundwater? Some economies will also be destroyed due to these regulations, many will lose their jobs. I think it should solely be the decision of a nation whether or not they do this. Each nation should govern and regulate as they see fit, not the WA telling them all what to do.

What do you guys think?

Buryasia, The Democracy Of Red Star, Legoa, Cyanation, Peacockastan, Free Southern Republics, Iwagoto, International Settlements

The Americanempire wrote:The thing in the WA seems stupid. What's the point in regulating all of these pollutants to such an extreme amount for the sake of groundwater? Some economies will also be destroyed due to these regulations, many will lose their jobs. I think it should solely be the decision of a nation whether or not they do this. Each nation should govern and regulate as they see fit, not the WA telling them all what to do.

What do you guys think?

I’m Pretty much thinking the same thing you are you are thinking...

Buryasia

The Democracy Of Red Star wrote:

I’m Pretty much thinking  the same thing you are you are thinking...

Yeah, unless it's a human rights issue, I see no point. As in unless it's a human rights issue, we shouldn't even be discussing it.

The Democracy Of Red Star

Who's in charge of the WA?

The Democracy Of Red Star

The Federation Of Spokane wrote:Can I have aid finding a ambassador? I know I’ll need one.

I'll help you find one.

If anyone here is interested in becoming the Ambassador fill out the following application and send it to [nation=noflag]The Federation of Spokane[/nation]. The duties of Ambassador would include but not be limited to joining embassy region's Discord servers, interacting with other regions in a respectable and professional manner, and working with the CTO in scouting out regions.

[spoiler=Click to show application]Are you a shareholder: [Y/N]

Are you in the AA Discord server:[Y/N]

How often are you online:

Would you be willing to report to the CTO for questions and works with him directly to scout out regions: [Y/N]

What is one reason that you should be considered for this position: [/spoiler]

Reformed Grols Seland wrote:Who's in charge of the WA?

I'm confused by what you mean by that.

Buryasia, The Democracy Of Red Star

Reformed Grols Seland wrote:Who's in charge of the WA?
Well we are... us WA members. But the General Secriatariat are responsible for ensuring legal proposals.

The Democracy Of Red Star

The Americanempire wrote:Yeah, unless it's a human rights issue, I see no point. As in unless it's a human rights issue, we shouldn't even be discussing it.

And clean water obviously isn't a human right.

The Democracy Of Red Star

Grater Tovakia wrote:Well we are... us WA members. But the General Secriatariat are responsible for ensuring legal proposals.

Grater, is it fine if I have my ambassador take care of the discord stuff for me and report to me about what is needed?(that is if I do get one:)

The Democracy Of Red Star, International Settlements

The Federation Of Spokane wrote:Grater, is it fine if I have my ambassador take care of the discord stuff for me and report to me about what is needed?(that is if I do get one:)

How many ambassadors do you need?

The Democracy Of Red Star

How does my new flag look? Is it okay or should it be changed into something different?

The Democracy Of Red Star, Vistryara

Iwagoto wrote:How does my new flag look? Is it okay or should it be changed into something different?

Doubleplusgood?

The Democracy Of Red Star

Iwagoto wrote:How does my new flag look? Is it okay or should it be changed into something different?

10 out of 10 ( I loved 1984)

The Federation Of Spokane wrote:

Grater, is it fine if I have my ambassador take care of the discord stuff for me and report to me about what is needed?(that is if I do get one:)

That would be fine

International Settlements wrote:How many ambassadors do you need?

One.

And thank you Grater!

Wow, my nation has waffled back and forth between anarchy and civil rights lovefest about 7 times in the last week.

International Settlements

The Democracy Of Red Star wrote:10 out of 10 ( I loved 1984)

I'm thinking of reading 1984, but I first got to finish up a lot of books before I get a chance to read it.

The Democracy Of Red Star, International Settlements

Iwagoto wrote:

I'm thinking of reading 1984, but I first got to finish up a lot of books before I get a chance to read it.

1984 is good, had to read it for school about a month ago and I liked the ideas and the mystery it had in the world. However it does very little to truly quench your curiously. Yet at the same time it allows you to truly examine our world today and understand how much our rights truly protect us. I did find the plot a little boring though.

Buryasia, The Democracy Of Red Star, Falkrend, International Settlements

The Americanempire wrote:1984 is good, had to read it for school about a month ago and I liked the ideas and the mystery it had in the world. However it does very little to truly quench your curiously. Yet at the same time it allows you to truly examine our world today and understand how much our rights truly protect us. I did find the plot a little boring though.

It kind *of Starts slow

The Americanempire

Buryasia wrote:Wow, my nation has waffled back and forth between anarchy and civil rights lovefest about 7 times in the last week.

Well after looking at your country, it seems to do well. Is anarchy ir civil-rights love fest your ideal gov?

The Democracy Of Red Star, International Settlements

I guess borderline anarchy is a pretty good description of my favored government form. As little government as possible, mostly controlled locally, not centrally, with lots of complicated checks and balances and a population invested in making it work.

Falkrend, International Settlements

Finally hit 50 million population!

The Cincinnatus Republic, Vistryara, International Settlements

Iwagoto wrote:Finally hit 50 million population!

My next milestone is 200 mil ... Quite a way off that though.

Ugh...it's going to take forever to be able to get a capitol.

International Settlements

Iwagoto wrote:Ugh...it's going to take forever to be able to get a capitol.
be patient it takes more than a few issues

International Settlements wrote:be patient it takes more than a few issues

Your population isn't actually related to how you answer your issues. Your population will go up automatically over time, there's nothing that you can really do to increase or decrease your population or how fast it grows.

Deims Kir, Falkrend, International Settlements

Hey everyone! I just joined Lands End! I've had many other NationStates (some pretty longstanding) in the past and wanted to come back to the game. This community seemed like a really great fit and your telegram was actually really convincing.

Btw, not that it really seems to matter here, but I'm not really an anarchist but it's probably gonna take a while before I get some issues that change that

Buryasia, Bluximburg, The Cincinnatus Republic, Legoa, Peacockastan, Free Southern Republics, Vistryara

Its Okay Here wrote:Hey everyone! I just joined Lands End! I've had many other NationStates (some pretty longstanding) in the past and wanted to come back to the game. This community seemed like a really great fit and your telegram was actually really convincing.

Btw, not that it really seems to matter here, but I'm not really an anarchist but it's probably gonna take a while before I get some issues that change that

Welcome to Land’s End!

Legoa, Peacockastan, Its Okay Here

Its Okay Here wrote:Hey everyone! I just joined Lands End! I've had many other NationStates (some pretty longstanding) in the past and wanted to come back to the game. This community seemed like a really great fit and your telegram was actually really convincing.

Btw, not that it really seems to matter here, but I'm not really an anarchist but it's probably gonna take a while before I get some issues that change that

Welcome! If you have held any semi administrative jobs, could you be my ambassador?

Bruh is expansion of government required for decreasing crime in this game

Norwalk wrote:Bruh is expansion of government required for decreasing crime in this game

The smaller your law enforcement stat, the larger your crime stats are usually. The stats aren't really too accurate in some cases.

Cairacos

Peacockastan wrote:The smaller your law enforcement stat, the larger your crime stats are usually. The stats aren't really too accurate in some cases.

Damn bruh im tryna use this simulator to create my ideal state can’t have all this crime

Norwalk wrote:Damn bruh im tryna use this simulator to create my ideal state can’t have all this crime

Don't worry, you'll get some more issues in the future that will allow you to get rid of some of that crime. Oh, and if you want to get some more out of the game then I would recommend that you join the WA because it's fun to be able to vote on stuff.

Cairacos

Peacockastan wrote:Don't worry, you'll get some more issues in the future that will allow you to get rid of some of that crime. Oh, and if you want to get some more out of the game then I would recommend that you join the WA because it's fun to be able to vote on stuff.

Does the WA legislation affect your nation?

Norwalk wrote:Does the WA legislation affect your nation?

I think that GA resolutions do mildly change some of your stats (very mildly), but SC resolutions don't affect them at all.

Cairacos

The Federation Of Spokane wrote:Welcome! If you have held any semi administrative jobs, could you be my ambassador?

Uhhh idk it's been a while--what would I have to do?

Its Okay Here wrote:Uhhh idk it's been a while--what would I have to do?

Let me TG you.

Its Okay Here wrote:Uhhh idk it's been a while--what would I have to do?

The duties of Ambassador would include but not be limited to joining embassy region's Discord servers, interacting with other regions in a respectable and professional manner, and working with the CTO in scouting out regions. Send the application below to The Federation Of Spokane if you are interested.

[spoiler]Are you a shareholder: [Y/N]

Are you in the AA Discord server:[Y/N]

How often are you online:

Would you be willing to report to the CTO for questions and works with him directly to scout out regions: [Y/N]

What is one reason that you should be considered for this position:[/spoiler]

The Federation Of Spokane wrote:Let me TG you.

aight sounds good

Buryasia, Legoa

Hey Peacockastan, why do you keep pulling you keep losing all of your endorsements?

Cyanation wrote:Hey Peacockastan, why do you keep pulling you keep losing all of your endorsements?

Both Peacockastan and I serve in the AA military known as the JTF which requires us to move our WAs around a lot. If you are interested in joining please read this: https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=967591

Peacockastan, South-Central Rhodesia, Vistryara

How's the search for senior management going?

And how exactly does raiding work in this?

Reformed Grols Seland wrote:How's the search for senior management going?

I need a ambassador, and that part is going bad.

Otherwise, it’s going swell!

Reformed Grols Seland wrote:And how exactly does raiding work in this?

Click here to see the abridged version, and click here to see the long version.

Cairacos

Cyanation wrote:Hey Peacockastan, why do you keep pulling you keep losing all of your endorsements?

I believe it has something to do with his R/D duties with the JTF.

Peacockastan

Fianlly improved my economy

Bluximburg, Deims Kir, The Americanempire, International Settlements

Vistryara wrote:Fianlly improved my economy

Good for you, keep it up

Glieria

Vistryara wrote:Fianlly improved my economy

Nice, I'm always trying to improve my economy but I've been trying to lower crime too.

I allowed some Labor laws to be cut and my income for the poor went from 55K to 33K.....

Norwalk

Peacockastan wrote:The smaller your law enforcement stat, the larger your crime stats are usually. The stats aren't really too accurate in some cases.

You can also reduce crime by increasing social programs (medicine, education, welfare, etc.). That's easiest in a state-planned economy, though.

Falkrend wrote:You can also reduce crime by increasing social programs (medicine, education, welfare, etc.). That's easiest in a state-planned economy, though.

Yeah I know. Just need the right issues to come around. I have another Communist Nation that's crime free but an inferior economy and a lot less freedoms.

Falkrend wrote:You can also reduce crime by increasing social programs (medicine, education, welfare, etc.). That's easiest in a state-planned economy, though.

Whether or not welfare reduces crime, it is still theft. If you haven't noticed, I am not a fan of welfare. I would rather have high crime rates than even a small amount of welfare. That is why my welfare stat is in the negatives, and it will stay there.

Cairacos, Falkrend

Peacockastan wrote:Whether or not welfare reduces crime, it is still theft. If you haven't noticed, I am not a fan of welfare. I would rather have high crime rates than even a small amount of welfare. That is why my welfare stat is in the negatives, and it will stay there.

Welfare is a placating measure.

Peacockastan

My new ambassador is Reformed Grols Seland! I have faith in him.

Bluximburg

The Federation Of Spokane wrote:My new ambassador is Reformed Grols Seland! I have faith in him.

Thanks for having me. TG me when you need something.

I think we could try get some new embassies setup but it's your call.

After doing some recruiting, I've noticed a lot of new nations in the region which is great! I would like to ask each and every one of these new nations to join the WA. If you don't know how to join or just have general questions either reply via RMB or send me a telegram. I would also like these same nations to endorse all other WA nations in the region once they do so. Also joining the WA will grant you the ability to apply for the position of shareholder. All shareholders in the region are given the right to vote in elections and obtain official positions, so I would greatly recommend that you send the following application to our COO, Grater Tovakia.

[spoiler=Click to show application...]Nation Name:

Founding Date:

WA Status (Y / N):[/spoiler]

If you have any questions about this region and its government, then I recommend that you read the following dispatches:

https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=704703

https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=1022812

Note that the listed occupants of these government positions listed in the government dispatch are out of date.

I would also like to take this chance to address my WA status which has been brought up a little bit, but none the less I would like to address it myself. The reason that it is dropping in and out is that I am a member of the Joint Task Force (The AA's military). If you want to join the JTF (and I strongly recommend that you do so simply because it's fun), then read the following dispatch:

https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=967591

Now that this long post is coming to an end (sorry), if you have any questions please do not be afraid to ask. You can ask me either via RMB or via telegram, either way is fine. Just remember to never be afraid to ask a question.

Buryasia, The Democracy Of Red Star, Bluximburg, Legoa, Free Southern Republics, Beyo

I just dealt with Nazis. I just silenced them.

Vistryara wrote:I just dealt with Nazis. I just silenced them.

Nice freedoms you got there.

Cyanation wrote:Nice freedoms you got there.

“War is peace.

Freedom is slavery.

Ignorance is strength.“

(I’m joking I’m a democracy)

Cyanation

The Democracy Of Red Star wrote:“War is peace.

Freedom is slavery.

Ignorance is strength.“

(I’m joking I’m a democracy)

I really need to read that book.

The Democracy Of Red Star

The Democracy Of Red Star wrote:“War is peace.

Freedom is slavery.

Ignorance is strength.“

(I’m joking I’m a democracy)

Funny you mention slavery, It's actually legal in my nation.

The Democracy Of Red Star, Free Southern Republics

Cyanation wrote:I really need to read that book.

Just to as a note it starts kind of slow.Its also very dark ,so you may want to take a break every now and then.Any how good luck and happy reading!😀 (p.s If you like it, I can give suggestions for more books like it.)

Reformed Grols Seland wrote:Funny you mention slavery, It's actually legal in my nation.

(Do u get the reference?)

I am a bit curious what everyone's idea of a utopia would be. would anyone like to share?

The Democracy Of Red Star, Vistryara

Mythel wrote:I am a bit curious what everyone's idea of a utopia would be. would anyone like to share?

Advance in magic and technology, little to no wars, people do what is considered morally right in todays world, no "overly politically" groups, nor and racsits.

Mythel, Legoa

My idea of a utopia is that no one would break laws and everyone would keep the environment clean.

Vistryara

Mythel wrote:I am a bit curious what everyone's idea of a utopia would be. would anyone like to share?

I feel like any Utopia I could think of, would be dystopia to me in reality.

Buryasia, The Cincinnatus Republic, Free Southern Republics, Iwagoto

Well presently my nation is a tyrannical dictatorship with absolutely no freedom or democratic principals and maximum regulations on everything besides business. My utopia would be run by trust in your fellow man however, and not an actual government, but that's not possible even in an advanced simulation like this.

Mythel wrote:I am a bit curious what everyone's idea of a utopia would be. would anyone like to share?

An Anarcho-capitalist society is my definition of a utopia.

The Democracy Of Red Star, South-Central Rhodesia, International Settlements

Who is it is it its full names ?

About the recent WA legislation: i dont have voting, so i like to have any reason possible to deny someone the right to vote available in case democracy comes back, so that then only i and a few others will be able to vote

Cyanation wrote:I feel like any Utopia I could think of, would be dystopia to me in reality.

interesting. given what it would probably take to maintain one, wouldn't all utopias be or become dystopias in the long run?

Peacockastan wrote:An Anarcho-capitalist society is my definition of a utopia.

my question is, can you actually have both capitalism and anarchy? I mean, if no authority exists then how can you claim to be the owner of whatever it is you're trying to sell me? if you can't claim to be the owner, then why would I have to pay you instead of just taking it since no one owned it? and if we agree on rules that allow people to actually own something, then those rules would serve as an authority, so could it still be called anarchy?

Deims Kir

Mythel wrote:interesting. given what it would probably take to maintain one, wouldn't all utopias be or become dystopias in the long run?

my question is, can you actually have both capitalism and anarchy? I mean, if no authority exists then how can you claim to be the owner of whatever it is you're trying to sell me? if you can't claim to be the owner, then why would I have to pay you instead of just taking it since no one owned it? and if we agree on rules that allow people to actually own something, then those rules would serve as an authority, so could it still be called anarchy?

Well, you'd need to be able to protect what you own. Fortify your place and stock up on weapons and whatnot, Anything to deter someone from stealing.

Doesn't sound like my idea of a utopia, more like a post apocalyptic hellhole.

My question is how can you make capitalism into a utopia, Maybe for the top 1%.

Cyanation, South-Central Rhodesia

Mythel wrote:I am a bit curious what everyone's idea of a utopia would be. would anyone like to share?

a world where everything, everyone, is the same. if everything thinks and works the same, wars and racism and everything that causes fighting ceases to be.

Confic wrote:a world where everything, everyone, is the same. if everything thinks and works the same, wars and racism and everything that causes fighting ceases to be.

Sounds good in theory but awfully boring. Everyone being the same is like some sort of hivemind where individually dosn't exist.

Cyanation

Confic wrote:a world where everything, everyone, is the same. if everything thinks and works the same, wars and racism and everything that causes fighting ceases to be.

that sounds less like a utopia and more like something along the lines of 1984 or fahrenheit. or some kind of sci-fi horror story. all you'd need to do is say that cybernetics was used to achieve this and you'd have either the cybermen or the borg!

Mythel wrote:my question is, can you actually have both capitalism and anarchy? I mean, if no authority exists then how can you claim to be the owner of whatever it is you're trying to sell me? if you can't claim to be the owner, then why would I have to pay you instead of just taking it since no one owned it? and if we agree on rules that allow people to actually own something, then those rules would serve as an authority, so could it still be called anarchy?

Well, it would be as simple as someone creating a private security business, and then people going to that private security business and then paying them for protection against criminals. This would further increase the value of the economy, which will allow for further wealth to be established. Also, I was thinking of a more realistic utopia. If we are talking about just whatever you want, then everyone would have everything they wanted, but that's not realistic. Also to claim something as your own, all you would have to do is claim it and then defend it from those who wish to take it from you. It's not rules, it's just protecting what is yours.

Legoa, Cairacos, Beyo

Reformed Grols Seland wrote:snip ...

My question is how can you make capitalism into a utopia,

snip

That's the $10 quadrillion question!

I got into the WA

Buryasia

Post by The Fifth Riche suppressed by Bluximburg.

The Fifth Riche

Is it okay for me to become a dictatorship and bring hitlers ideas back

Peacockastan wrote:Well, it would be as simple as someone creating a private security business, and then people going to that private security business and then paying them for protection against criminals. This would further increase the value of the economy, which will allow for further wealth to be established. Also, I was thinking of a more realistic utopia. If we are talking about just whatever you want, then everyone would have everything they wanted, but that's not realistic. Also to claim something as your own, all you would have to do is claim it and then defend it from those who wish to take it from you. It's not rules, it's just protecting what is yours.

1: if you're buying protection from criminals in an anarchy, you're being scammed. 2: what stops a business from getting powerful enough that it becomes an authority? all it takes is one monopoly or megacorp deciding it knows best and the "anarcho" in "anarcho-capitalism" is gone. 3: what if I don't have the strength or manpower to defend myself from one particular threat, or if the people I hire to protect my stuff decide it'd be more profitable if they themselves were to steal it? 4: what I got from this is that your idea of utopia is basically what society has been brought to in the fallout franchise.

I do have to note that I feel that people should be allowed to do what they want as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else. anarchy, however, would allow even the things that directly harm others. rape, murder, theft, forcing people into slavery; all okay in an anarchy as long as the victim doesn't have the means to stop the assailant. I have to agree with the quote below in calling an anarchy a hellhole.

Reformed Grols Seland wrote:Well, you'd need to be able to protect what you own. Fortify your place and stock up on weapons and whatnot, Anything to deter someone from stealing.

Doesn't sound like my idea of a utopia, more like a post apocalyptic hellhole.

My question is how can you make capitalism into a utopia, Maybe for the top 1%.

1: maybe we should have stayed in the vault. 2: capitalism is currently the best system we have, I just don't think it's a wise idea to let it go completely unchecked.

Beyo

Mythel wrote:<snip>

To answer #2, just stop working for that particular corporation and do whatever necessary to stop such a thing from happening, without workers they will lose profit and will, therefore, fail in a capitalist system. Again, this isn't really a utopia, more of a realistic ideal state. I guess that my definition of a true utopia would be one where the equality of opportunity is provided, so that everyone can move up in society and get rich, and only those who refuse to work don't get money. To answer #4, you have to understand that these protection services would purely profit off of protecting, so if all of a sudden they decided to not protect, they would lose profit and therefore fail in a capitalist system. And if you don't have enough money to pay for protection, I have two answers for that. #1 You better hope someone protects you in goodwill and charity. #2 You should've worked harder. Again, this isn't my real definition of a true utopia, I stated that before, it is more of a realistic ideal state.

And as for protecting yourself and others, pay security companies that will protect you and that will, in turn, boost the economy. Win, Win.

Cairacos

Peacockastan wrote:To answer #2, just stop working for that particular corporation and do whatever necessary to stop such a thing from happening, without workers they will lose profit and will, therefore, fail in a capitalist system. Again, this isn't really a utopia, more of a realistic ideal state. I guess that my definition of a true utopia would be one where the equality of opportunity is provided, so that everyone can move up in society and get rich, and only those who refuse to work don't get money. To answer #4, you have to understand that these protection services would purely profit off of protecting, so if all of a sudden they decided to not protect, they would lose profit and therefore fail in a capitalist system. And if you don't have enough money to pay for protection, I have two answers for that. #1 You better hope someone protects you in goodwill and charity. #2 You should've worked harder. Again, this isn't my real definition of a true utopia, I stated that before, it is more of a realistic ideal state.

And as for protecting yourself and others, pay security companies that will protect you and that will, in turn, boost the economy. Win, Win.

I agree Utopia is impossible to achieve in reality. Capitalism isn't perfect but it works well as long as it doesn't go too far.

But we could probably make a dystopia happen quite easily.

Peacockastan wrote:To answer #2, just stop working for that particular corporation and do whatever necessary to stop such a thing from happening, without workers they will lose profit and will, therefore, fail in a capitalist system. Again, this isn't really a utopia, more of a realistic ideal state. I guess that my definition of a true utopia would be one where the equality of opportunity is provided, so that everyone can move up in society and get rich, and only those who refuse to work don't get money. To answer #4, you have to understand that these protection services would purely profit off of protecting, so if all of a sudden they decided to not protect, they would lose profit and therefore fail in a capitalist system. And if you don't have enough money to pay for protection, I have two answers for that. #1 You better hope someone protects you in goodwill and charity. #2 You should've worked harder. Again, this isn't my real definition of a true utopia, I stated that before, it is more of a realistic ideal state.

And as for protecting yourself and others, pay security companies that will protect you and that will, in turn, boost the economy. Win, Win.

again, what if the protection companies decide it'd be more profitable if they were the thieves? what if the closest protection agency is more likely to run a protection racket than provide a protection service? with out agreeing on rules, what reason would the very people I hire have to not rob me blind? after all, taking all my stuff and then forcing me to pay tribute would be more profitable to them than actually protecting my stuff for me and then getting a wage based on that. wouldn't I have to , ironically, be tougher than the very guards I was hiring in order to make sure they did their job instead of stealing my stuff? at the end of the day, no matter how much money I have, solution 1 is the only true solution for those who can't protect themselves as the guards I hire would need at least a tiny bit of honor or goodwill to stick to the agreed transaction despite it being less profitable then just taking everything I have away from me.

and just if make sure you get this point: even if the protection agency does the exact opposite of its job, it can still make money by using brute force to make its "clients" to pay tribute against their will

also, what am I paying them in to begin with? if there's no government, then there technically isn't any currency, so am I just paying them in food? water? bottle caps? is there a bank that runs the currency system, and if so how is the group that controls the currency not an authority figure itself? is this just a system of trades?

and for the post you're responding to, I think you missed the point with my second point. if a business is big enough then it doesn't matter whether I personally work for it or not, it'd already have the power to make even people who originally weren't affiliated with it do what it says. true, a business without workers is doomed to fail, but chances are the people that were working for the business would either already agree with the company's agenda or wouldn't care because their lives weren't going to change that much. if a megacorp decides to take over as the defacto government then it probably already has the firepower force it's will onto most of the formerly lawless people whether they were working for it or not.

if a monopoly does the same thing, especially if it's a monopoly on something vital, then I think you'll tend to find that being the only one who can provide something that others need can make it much easier for you to get your way. if you're the only one who can give the people water, most of them will probably be willing to be your slaves in exchange for not dying of dehydration. the starving man would gladly trade their gold for a filling meal. if you need something and only one person in the lawless land can provided it, then you either find a way to steal it or you just well bend over and let them have their way with you.

and the most important part is that with both the monopoly and the megacorp, no matter what you do people will be willing to work with them, either because they share the company's ideals or because they see it as the quickest way to a comfortable life. it's not nearly as simple as just not working for them and going against them since the world doesn't revolve around any one person.

in short, you'd be surprised what kind of madness people can get away with in a capitalist system when there isn't any actual rules to follow. though I am curious what the actual result of an anarchy would be. I say we should find a large body of land for experimentation, allow some volunteers to take whatever they can carry into this "lawless zone", and observe how the people in this area behave for a couple generations.

Reformed Grols Seland wrote:I agree Utopia is impossible to achieve in reality. Capitalism isn't perfect but it works well as long as it doesn't go too far.

But we could probably make a dystopia happen quite easily.

make a dystopia happen you say? that's easy, just nuke everything and watch the survivors suffer.

I just made a capital city. Are there other issues that let you have more customization?

Beyo

Tradetown wrote:I just made a capital city. Are there other issues that let you have more customization?

Yeah, it lets you customize your leader and national religion later on.

Buryasia, Beyo

Mythel wrote:<snip>

Okay, I'm willing to admit and believe that an anarchy may not be the best solution to the problem, but nonetheless, I still hate the idea of government interfering with business. So I propose a minarchist solution. (which for everyone who is unfamiliar with the theory of minarchism, then here is the definition - A state whose only functions are to provide its citizens with the military, the police, and courts, thus protecting them from aggression, theft, breach of contract and fraud and enforcing property laws.) Although the government may be important in some places, I sill absolutely despise the possibility of government intervention in the free market.

Cairacos

Minarchism I belive is the perfect solution, in Minarchism the Government has one job which is to enforce the NAP

The Fifth Riche wrote:I got into the WA

congrats

Grater Tovakia wrote:Minarchism I belive is the perfect solution, in Minarchism the Government has one job which is to enforce the NAP

is there anything preventing a monopoly?

Peacockastan wrote:Okay, I'm willing to admit and believe that an anarchy may not be the best solution to the problem, but nonetheless, I still hate the idea of government interfering with business. So I propose a minarchist solution. (which for everyone who is unfamiliar with the theory of minarchism, then here is the definition - A state whose only functions are to provide its citizens with the military, the police, and courts, thus protecting them from aggression, theft, breach of contract and fraud and enforcing property laws.) Although the government may be important in some places, I sill absolutely despise the possibility of government intervention in the free market.

this does address most of my issues with anarchy. in fact, it actually sounds somewhat similar to what my own idea of utopia is like, though I think we still differ in many areas.

my idea of what people should be able to do is that anything that doesn't harm anyone else should be fair game. you want to buy drugs? you're the only victim, so go ahead. you want to sell drugs? not your fault there's a market, and it's a fair transaction. you want to compete in a gladiator fight for money? just sign this waver and you're good to go.

I do still have one question about your idea of utopia, however. would the state be allowed to directly participate in the economy? to clarify, what I mean is would you be okay with the state making businesses to fund itself and having those businesses compete with the privately owned businesses around it? I personally don't see much of a problem, but I'm curious about what you think.

Buryasia

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Written by Refuge Isle.