Post Archive
Region: Libertatem
* purr *
You're correct - you won't find a mention of referendum in our laws. Hence implicit rather than explicit.
Note that Article 7, Section 7, does give the people of Libertatem a right to form and keep any government they so choose; this would logically include an alternative legislative process like the referendum just conducted. The same section also notes that our founder does have the power to dispute the decision to change the flag and do away with the precedent for referenda all in one fell swoop - needless to say, that would not be a very popular move.
I've requested that the founder come Herr to clarify this issue.
I don't know what it is, but there's just something I like about Cenk Uygur, the guy from The Young Turks. He seems like a nice guy.
Alderney And Liberty City
I think there are three crucial positions that make you a libertarian: opposition to minimum wage laws, the Drug War and gun control.
Three is too many. I say the one crucial position that makes you a libertarian - or at least reasonable - is an opposition to big government.
Article 7 is made for individual rights. It says that you can hold any government in your nation that you please. Not the power to damn the rest of the Constitution by majority rule. You are looking at it from a collective view, that is for individuals. The precedent has been set that the regional government does not have the rights of an individual.
Pevvania
The previous section also says that all rights not granted to the regional government belong to the people.
Conservatives also claim to be opposed to big government, and even Democrats do so from time to time.
A fine point by Minerva. I'm too tired to go too much into this, but I think we should hold off on the flag change until Lib gives his two cents.
The difference is that libertarians are serious.
Indeed. We'll wait for Lib's opinion.
We need minimum wage laws, but the current ones are way too high.
Minerva?
That's your name now, apparently.
Sorry. I'm tired.
Ummm... Then what is the appropriate price floor for wages?
Constitutional amendment is granted to the regional government.
The right to change the flag is not explicitly granted to the regional government. Wouldn't it fall to reason that this right would be granted to the people?
No it wouldn't.
The standing legal principle is that a flag change is a constitutional amendment which is granted to the regional government.
http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=337206
I know this might kinda be personal for some, but I'm just curious. How many of us are female or male in this region?
I am pretty sure that this region like most regions is a sausage fest.
Hallo Island
You're absolutely correct. We do need laws enforcing a minimum wage.
One that is non-existent, because everything else just leads to an enormous amount of problems.
Pevvania, Alderney And Liberty City
I'm pretty sure that many also like sausage.
Alderney And Liberty City
Good night, everybody!
Pevvania
After careful deliberation, I have chosen a Manager of State.
There were multiple applicants, but I've chosen [nation=short]Muh Roads[/nation]. I've been meaning to add him to my Cabinet for a long time now, and this will probably be my final opportunity to do so.
I figured, I honestly don't know any girls who are libertarian here in Quebec, let alone right wing. They're mostly philosophically inept and going along with we're being taught, liberals who think they're promoting "human rights" and mainstream feminists who as much as what they're talking about as a peanut.
I identify as a nonbinary transmasculine two-spirit.
You live in Quebec?! *shudders*
Quebec is a liberal hell.
That's an understatement. I've lived in liberal hells. Quebec is something else. It's deeply racist, crushingly bureaucratic and utterly cultureless. It is a tasteless, fascistic dump.
Yay!!!!!!
I applaud the fact that you are and that you oppose anti-discrimination laws.
Most people I know would agree with you Pevvania, but instead they advocate a reverse-racist, democratic socialist and forced multiculture (aka non-western) state. They don't understand the concept of natural rights special privileges. You basically have to choose between Ultra-nationalistic franco-state or an forceful liberal hell.
Basically, according to my interpretation of the law, a referendum is fine, but there must be a symbol of anticommunism on the flag, visible to the eye. If you don't like that, then pursue a constitutional amendment to remove Article VIII.
Post self-deleted by The United Libertarian American Republic.
Ok that would be easy. Symbols could just be put in the blue areas like the anti Com symbol,the statue of liberty and other Libertatem and or Libertarian symbols.
That would ruin it.
The constitution is a worthless piece of crap. The goals and definitions of a region change, yet we are still bound to a document that had been made in a different period and population. Democracy is often derided as a tool for collectivism, but it begs the point: How else can liberty be secured if cultural changes are only so effective? If this region was founded as a Nazi region, and there was a constitution binding ourselves to the Nazi ideology, would it not make sense for an overwhelmingly modern liberal populace to reject it and create a new one if the majority willed it?
Alderney And Liberty City
President Minerva 2015! Unless the Lord our Roads runs.
Which is why it's desperate for amendments.
Fun fact: 22% of Americans have libertarian leaning beliefs, but that doesn't stop the state from ignoring such a large segment of people. In any way, libertarians still have to educate others, and democracy has only been the best way to represent the people. A multi party state would ensure that libertarians would get the representation they want instead of hanging off the fringes of the Repubs. Democracy is something that can be a force for good, but is currently ignored.
Minerva's flag is an implicit symbol of our War on Communism. We've got plenty of libertarian and anti-authoritarian symbolism in it that illustrates our military efforts in support of this War.
And since the majority has voted in favor of it, that does mean that Liberosia has granted his blessing for the flag change (even if it is begrudgingly), right?
Republic Of Minerva, Alderney And Liberty City
hi guys !!!
the president of the united environmentalist states of mhomen
i like our flag. It is perfectly fine.
So apparently the democrats want to sell to the American people the first woman president, after the first black president. As always this seems to be their only argument in favor of their lifelong bureaucrats candidates with really poor results.
What will it be after that ? The first homosexual president ? The first asian president ?
And the most terrible thing is that this is actually working, people here in Europe are already supporting her ( even the members of the french government on twitter... diplomacy f*** you ), even if they don't have a single clue about what she has done during her political career and despite her terrible performance as secretary of state.
Some interviews of average americans show the same thing over and over, they cannot argue in her favor without mentioning her gender, and very often this is like their only reason to say they are ready to vote for her.
Idiocracy is coming.
United Environmentalist States Of Mhomen
So apparently the Nutzis somehow got control of Islam. I guess the term "Islamofascist" now fits the region.
http://www.nationstates.net/region=islam
United Environmentalist States Of Mhomen, Alderney And Liberty City
No, he said that Article 8 would have to be repealed or amended. Which is what I have been saying for months.
United Environmentalist States Of Mhomen
I got a telegram from their former leader. Apparently their Founder rose from the dead and took over.
United Environmentalist States Of Mhomen
Can the Board please fast-track Humph's citizenship? I motioned this several days ago and have only gotten one vote so far.
United Environmentalist States Of Mhomen
That's exactly what I fear.
United Environmentalist States Of Mhomen
No, he said this:
I can name three symbols of anticommunism, each of which are visible.
The blue borders are the same color as our old flag, and represents the capitalism the communists lack.
The existence of a centerpiece is the same as our old flag, and the yellow around it represents the libertarianism the statists lack.
The message of the Gadsden snake is "Don't Tread On Me", our policy against the Red aggressors who, by their very actions, justify the continued existence of our War.
Not only is our flag a symbol of libertarianism, but it's also a symbol of anti-authoritarianism, with some reactionary elements from our old flag thrown in. To that end, changes to Article VIII are not necessary at this time... though I do wish we could get rid of the pesky clauses that suggest we need to attack "libertarian communists" and ally with fascists.
United Environmentalist States Of Mhomen
Well, it appears as though the flag has not passed.
United Environmentalist States Of Mhomen
That's great, but any legislation also has to pass the Board. Has it even been brought to the Board?
As a Libertarian Populist i think that the people have the power. The power of the Board comes from the people. So if the people have approved a change then why should their Representatives have the power to counter the will of the people?
Conservative Idealism In Libertatem, Alderney And Liberty City, Continental Commonwealths
What a bunch o bull. The flag is a part of the WFE and should be changed without prevedent
http://rare.us/story/michael-reagan-rand-paul-gets-my-dad/
wow, Reagan's son says Paul represents his dads foreign policy. How can the GOP establishment fight that? Reagan's family would know Ron best.
Alderney And Liberty City
Well, the constitution says other why
3 votes on waiving Humph's citizenship requirement. All for, so far. If we don't get two more votes today, I'll finalise it and Humph can be a citizen again.
I always smile when people insinuate that Reagan was some kind of a war hawk. He was certainly no non-interventionist, arming anti-communist forces abroad and using military force when necessary, but I think libertarians can admire his hostility to war and desire for peace with the Soviet Union. He also resisted the influence of neo-conservatism in the party, passing over Jeanne Kirkpatrick for Secretary of State for the more pragmatic George Shultz. Reagan once remarked about neo-conservatives that "Those sons of bitches wont be happy until we have 25,000 troops in Managua, and I'm not going to do it."
Conservative Idealism In Libertatem
Incorrect. The whole point of a referendum is for the people to enact legislative change themselves, and of Board participants, two voted for and two voted against. Besides, the power to change the WFE - and by extension, the flag - is completely outside of the Board's authority.
The Constitution does not so much as mention the flag.
The majority have voted in favor of Minerva's proposal, and it meets the standards our founder has put in place. Now, if there are no further objections...
The United Libertarian American Republic
I think we should defer to the founder on this one, who is clearly the highest authority on this matter, and either draft a new flag proposal or revisit the issue later.
I'm drafting the CITIZEN Act (again, I need help with an acronym). It will include transferable citizenship, so that nations who have CTE'd, renounced their citizenship or are using another nation can immediately get their citizenship back pending approval by the IAD.
Please TG me or post suggestions so I can get this on the floor of the House!
Conservative Idealism In Libertatem
Did [nation=Muh Roads] agree to become Manager of State?
The people are the best source of power within any region, and the majority voted for. Therefore, I see no reason as to why there is even a discussion. The President has agreed, the people through referendum have agreed, and many foreign agents visiting also agreed. The only section of government that didn't agree is the Board, which is currently composed of one party and of course, would want to keep a flag that shows that we hate sickles and hammers. It makes no sense. Having a Libertarian flag makes much more sense, as it actually represents what we believe in, Libertarianism (Unlike a Sickle and Hammer with a cross on it, which simply represents ignorance). This matter is also not a matter of the board according to the constitution.
Conservative Idealism In Libertatem
Ideally, yes. In practice, hell no.
The way the game works means that the Founder is always the ultimate authority in every region, ever, and always will be unless he for some reason decides to give up his magical powers.
Ours has not given up his magical powers, and seeing as how currently Liberosia's account is currently the only one that has access to editing the region, it's up to him to decide if he's going to change the flag or not.
Pevvania, The New United States, Muh Roads
Uh, get rid of one of those "currently"s, didn't notice I had two.
Pev, call it the Comprehensive Indemnity Transfer for Identified Zealous Expatriated Nations Act.
I am not familiar with the opinion of the entire Board, but as you may recall I said I would vote for whatever the region wanted. But since Liberosia had clarified this on a constitutional level, I must defend the Constitution.
"Democracy" and "the will of the people" can be dangerous things indeed. I personally don't think this is a big issue, but I pledged to uphold the Constitution and I will continue to do so.
Great! Any suggestions as to what else should go in the bill?
Muh Roads will have to resign from his Board seat to take on the job, keep in mind.
Yes, Muh has agreed to accept the Manager position. Though I think that means we need to elect someone to his Board seat...
Nations that move away from the region should be given a more gracious waiting period before their citizenship is revoked, and whatever time period that is should be doubled if they consult the IAD before their departure and inform them that they will return.
Oh, and providing expatriated/vacationing citizens a means of voting from abroad would be ideal as well.
I'll run to replace Lord Roads on the Board as a Independent.
hello!
Alderney And Liberty City
Hello highly obvious commie spy, what brings you here?
Alderney And Liberty City
Why do nations lose their citizenship when they leave the region? That seems a bit nationalistic. Letting folks have citizenship permanently (unless they renounce it or have it revoked) would also be a good way to attract more nations to the region.
Republic Of Minerva, Conservative Idealism In Libertatem, Alderney And Liberty City, Continental Commonwealths
I am interested in the position as soon as my Citizenship comes through. Running as an Independent. Of course.
I would also be interested in running for Seat Three of the Board, representing the Party for Resistance and Reform.
Any job you can get, right?
Well, our message board is open to nations in allied regions, and we do have a variety of other tools at our disposal that could make involvement in the region's government possible without having a nation physically present here. Is this the direction we want to go?
This is an older post, but here's my two cents on it.
"Libertarian" was initially used to describe French anarcho-communists, and later anarchists and anti-Vanguardist socialists in general. Eventually, it referred to American neoclassical liberals and moderate conservatives. So, I'd see opposition to an authoritarian state as the core aspect of libertarianism, along with a disdain for coercive hierarchy and individualism. I see libertarianism as more of a mindset than a specific ideology, which focuses on individual rights over a oppressive hierarchy or collective. And, taken to it's logical conclusions, I see that libertarian mindset as being radically anti-statist, anti-capitalist, voluntaryist if not pacifist, anti-religious and feminist.
To quote Benjamin Tucker, "if the individual has the right to govern himself, all external government is tyranny."
Add "promotion of" before individualism.
I was offered a position in the Judicial Department, offered a position as Manager of State, and offered a seat on te Board. I declined the first and was rejected for the second. I don't see that as taking anything I can get.
I vote to AYE regarding Humpheria's citizenship.
I am running for president American.
Yes I have agreed to take on the manager of state position, however, CI, if you find a better suitor than let them have the position. I enjoy being on the board very much :)
I may support a Minerva presidency my lord Roads. He is more Populist. He puts the People's wants before the wants of The Board.
No worries American. My campaign will certainly be like no other though. I've got plans and they are going to be put to action very soon.
Just make sure that you stay active through the campaign. OK Lord Roads;)
Heheh won't be a problem this time. I've almost finished training with the new job. I'm moving much closer to it this week too, a 140 mile commute everyday has been no fun. City life sucks, gonna miss my big backyard and porch, but my new apartment is pretty dang nice as far as apartments go..
BOARD VOTE
Waiving the Citizenship Waiting Period for Humpheria
Pevvania AYE
Hallo Island AYE
Right-Winged Nation AYE
Northern Prussia NAY
Muh Roads AYE
By a vote of 4-1, Board votes in FAVOUR of restoring the citizenship of Humpheria.
The CITIZEN Act (or perhaps FRAUD II) will include
-Transferable citizenship
-Permanent citizenship regardless of residence
-Expanded Board power to challenge the IAD
Other items on my agenda for this month include
-Comprehensive constitutional reform
-An act to affirm the status of the War
-An act addressing the flag
The election to replace Muh Roads should occur today. Who are the candidates other than Humpheria?
Conservative Idealism In Libertatem, Hallo Island
I spent a few minutes documenting rates of gun ownership and gun homicide state-by-state. The data is out of sync, with the ownership rates being in 2007 and the gun murders being recorded in 2010, so I will update it with more recent data. There isn't any strong correlation between the two. Take a look for yourselves.
http://i.imgur.com/iBK6Z8f.png
I will say, though, that the graph seems to show an initial increase in gun murders per 100,000 people as the gun ownership rate goes up, but then murders tend to decline after the 25% mark. Vermont has the lowest amount of gun murders in the nation, at 0.3 per 100,000 people, but a gun ownership rate of 42%, which is quite high.
I'm glad to see that you chose the PRR, it is kind of a dead party since Actum left.
Alderney And Liberty City
Post self-deleted by The New United States.
I want in on helping with the items on the agenda, so I'll throw my hat in the ring.
I request to run as the RLP's candidate. If that is not possible, I will run as an independent.
Woah.
I've got more influence than CI.
Neat.
Also,
"6 hours ago: Lack there of ceased to exist."
We've got a distinct lack of Lack.
Hey! My campaign was pretty great. Good luck in topping it.
There goes my electorate.
That's a very warped way of looking at it, but nonetheless each to his own.
FRAUD was written at a time when embassy posting didn't exist and honestly, I just didn't think about people that come back. So, I would support an amendment to FRAUD.
First RLP member to declare their candidacy automatically gets the nomination, unless barred from seeking office or another party candidate comes up.
Excellent. FRAUD II is under construction.
Darn. I might as well drop out now.
Lol, quote of the day talking about Cold War: ¨No one votes for communism, the USSR invaded and took over. You would have to be retarded to vote for communism.¨From my professor on history
Miencraft, Pevvania, Republic Of Minerva, Conservative Idealism In Libertatem
Humph, you're an independent now, remember?
Yes, but the RLP is still my electorate.
On a lighter note, Fortside Rock Radio's main playlist is up to 50 songs, including Boston's More Than A Feeling. Special thanks to Miencraft's Diamond Radio for playing that song first!
Pevvania
That is a good , our flag says no communism , which is good !!!
Ironically we allow communists to inhabit this region, if they wish
Conservative Idealism In Libertatem
Peaceful communists who wish to debate. We are anti-Communist not anti-Communists.
Continental Commonwealths
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