Post Archive
Region: Libertatem
Or Wikipedia, which is in fact a reputable source, which says that it was manmade. It wouldn't say that if it was some right wing American conspiracy theory.
and i'm sure it's not [nation=Republic of Minerva]'s fault that he tried to contact Nazi gameplayers for help when he was humiliated as your War Manager, too.
and it's surely not your fault that you pardoned him for attempting to collude with fascists (whatever happened to REATO being anti-fascist? oh, that's right, you don't actually have any victories over the fash)
"I don't know anything about communists so I'm going to attack you based on what I think communists are like!"
I have been entirely polite up until your buddy compared me to Holocaust deniers. But it's not his fault he did that, either, is it?
this is the funniest post I think I've ever seen.
I think we're about done here.
Seems like you can't answer the question and are questioning my intelligence. I know damn well what communists are.
you sure about that?
Pretty damn confident. Listen i have a BBQ to be at, good luck spreading your red propaganda.
Hallo Island
That's just it - "up until". You're essentially saying that his words - which he is entirely willing to take responsibility for - absolve you when it comes to taking responsibility for your own... that you no longer have to be polite because someone else made a comparison you didn't like.
comparing me to a Holocaust denier is pretty rude, yeah, so I feel absolutely no compulsion to be polite to y'all.
if you don't like it I've explained several times how to stop us from posting here. but I guess it's not your fault that we can still post, either, is it?
Come on, people! Don't tell me this isn't getting stupid. Can we go back to debating economics or the Holodomor or anything? Just not this, please.
You think communists are unemployed wretches that dress up in Mao Zedong suits and call random people "comrades"? Well, that's me essentially...
You know what? That's the price we pay for defending your freedom to speak here.
I've got places to be as well, and I don't want to drag this on, so I'll conclude with this: You might get your kicks "correcting" the political views of your opponents in a videogame, and that's fine - you're not alone in that. We are not obligated to like one another, or even to get along with one another; in this particular arena, we happen to be enemies, and neither of us are going down without a fight. Just don't think that this - or any reason you can concoct - exempts you from affording your opponents even a modicum of decency; civility is the cornerstone of effective communication, especially if you intend to get your views across to us. We're all mature individuals here (or, at least, are trying to be); perhaps we should act like it.
Miencraft, Kings Island, Hallo Island
jesus christ it's a video game no one is "defending any freedoms" like some noble sacrifice has taken place to enable embassy posting on your board.
this is a lot of words that you're directing at me but I don't see you calling out Pevvania for equating me and my friends with Holocaust deniers, or Right-winged nation for his bizarre attacks on me and my professional life, or anyone else in your camp who has been less than perfect.
in short: get off your high horse.
Hell, I'll equate you with a holocaust denier. Saying that a mass murder was just an oopsie by your perfect system of government is highly offensive to the people that died because of Stalin's incompetence.
Miencraft, Kings Island, Pevvania, Right-Winged Nation, Condealism, Midland County
"murder" requires intent which was absent, if you actually cared to read what serious historians have to say and not your favorite fash propagandists
I guess Wikipedia and all of its cited sources are just "fash propagandists", right?
Once again
hey, I can quote things I posted that you ignored too!
i can get y'all a link to the full text of Davies/Wheatcroft if you want to read it. Pevvania cited it so you know it's not just Soviet agitprop.
jump on the IRC I posted before if you want it.
Jesus guys, everybody needs to take a chill pill. Debate is good.
yeah but calling the other side Holocaust deniers isn't.
Is this supposed to be some kind of a 'gotcha'? Just because we attack your idols for their killings sprees it doesn't mean we have to defend western atrocities.
Also, I like your profile picture. "You just blew my mind!"
the difference between us and you all is that you actually idolize Ronald Reagan.
there has been plenty of criticism of Stalin in leftist circles. no one actually idolizes him except for tankies.
we're simply setting the record straight and providing plenty of citations and you guys are plugging your ears and screaming "SOVIET PROPAGANDA!" while turning to your Bulgarian buddies, Wikipedia (lmao), and sources that you didn't even briefly skim (you, citing Davies/Wheatcroft) as legitimate sources.
Gee, you're still sore about that, huh?
i see you're still ignoring my sources. you're still sore about being wrong, huh?
how's your Bulgarian friend who never lived under communism doing?
The fascists, I admit, are more militarily competent than most of your ilk, which is why it's been difficult to target them. Most of their major regions lock executive powers and are very difficult to infiltrate. But I like to think that we've had some decent grabs over the years, often in cooperation with other regions, such as the seizure of The New German Reich. I believe that we also made a small contribution to the liberation of Anne Frank, but I personally could not participate because I was - ironically - visiting the Anne Frank Museum at the time in Amsterdam.
My comparison stands because that's what it is. I'm sure you're a nice guy in real life, but denialism is denialism is denialism. You don't like Nazis so you condemn the Holocaust for the vile act that it was. But you like Communists, so you're clearly willing to cut them more slack if they did things you agree with. Even if what you've claimed is correct - that the Holodomor was not targeted against ethnic Ukrainians and that it was not a genocide - and even if we assume that Stalin did not engineer it, and that he tried to stop it after it started (which, as I've demonstrated, we know for a fact is not true), he is still responsible for the deaths of millions of Ukrainians as a result of the system of central planning and collectivised agriculture that he constructed which, one way or another, is responsible for the famine, whether it was used intentionally to kill or fell victim to administrative failures. The one good thing Lenin did, aside from overthrowing the Tsar and redistributing land (which, yes, is a practice we sometimes favour), was implementing the NEP, which led to swift economic recovery in the post-civil war period of Russia. Perhaps, if the Communist Party had continued this policy, the USSR could have some day moved towards a capitalist economy and become prosperous. But Stalin tore this down, and replaced an economy where people could keep some of the product of their labour and trade it on the open market with a violent, brutal system of centralised command and control where the voices of the workers, the businessmen, the marginalised, the weak, were silenced in the face of an unstoppable political juggernaut that sought total control of every facet of life. The belief that you can give all the guns, all the power and all the money to a single group of men, to one man, and expect them to act virtuously and intelligently, is utterly delusional, as the human experience has taught us so many times. No one individual has access to all the knowledge in society. Every individual knows only a portion of the collective knowledge, which changes far too quickly and is too widely dispersed for any single institution to have access to all or even most of it. Markets, on the other hand, arise through the spontaneous order of millions of individuals interacting in their own self-interest to better themselves, leading to vast swathes of knowledge being accessible to many via price signals, which, similarly, rise and fall based on decentralised, individual interactions. Stalin did not understand the spontaneous order, nor did he understand economics, which is why his planned economy was doomed to fail, as it did in the Ukrainian Famine and as it did through the Great Stagnation and as it did in the 1980s until it collapsed. Whatever way you see it, the Soviets f--ked up, and a devastating famine that led to corpses rotting on the street, cannibalism, murder and millions of deaths was the fault of a collectivised economy that was inherently inefficient. Whether it was intentional or not, Stalin killed those Ukrainians, and he's probably rotting in hell for it.
And I challenge you to find any neoliberal state atrocity that we'll deny occurring. We are not fans of the American war machine. I am not a fan of the My Lai Massacre, or Reagan sponsoring Saddam Hussein, or the Trail of Tears, or the destruction the US has caused in the Middle East. But needless to say, none of these compare in sheer scope to the atrocities committed by the fascist and communist regimes of the 20th Century.
Hallo Island, Condealism, Midland County
Not at all. Reagan is not an automatically libertarian icon, and his legacy is still heavily debated. I have plenty of criticisms of him. But I don't turn the other way and pretend that he didn't cause some very bad things to happen.
Nevertheless, he was a tireless crusader for workers' rights and individual liberty, and a good symbol for our War on Communism.
Why do you keep mentioning that Bulgarian guy? Do you have some kind of a grudge against Bulgarians or something?
I try to read all the posts directed at me. I think that ignoring people who have a valid point to make is rude. Saying that capitalism is oppressive is saying that nature is oppressive, because the simple act of being born means that you're responsible for taking care of yourself after you reach the age at which you can do so. Nobody else is entitled to the product of someone else's labour.
he seems to have an incredibly warm reception here that borders on fanatic. You don't see us falling over ourselves to start a STALINTO, do you? We don't celebrate Stalin's (or any leftist leader) birthday as a regional holiday, but you celebrate Reagan's. it's creepy. it's weird.
and you absolutely made every excuse in the book for the Iran-Contra affair, so don't sit there and pretend that you "don't turn the other way" when you absolutely do.
not at all, but thanks for the implication that I do. :) it's just hilarious that Hallo rejects scholarly published works from peer-reviewed journals or real historians but relies on the word of his friend who never experienced the famine as a reliable source. it's absolutely absurd.
i'm not the one claiming it. i'm referring to legitimate scholars who have spent much of their life studying the Soviet Union and what happened in Ukraine. you yourself cited Davies/Wheatcroft.
your whole entire point - the point every single one of you has been trying to drive home - is that the 1933 famine was an intentional, malicious act by Stalin to kill Ukrainians.
that isn't true, as serious historians have argued, which you would have known if you hadn't skipped right past all the things I posted because it didn't fit with your pre-conceived notions about how communism works.
what is true is that millions of people in the entire Soviet Union (not just Ukraine, although it was worst there) died due to the famine in 1932-33. not a single person is denying that. of course it's a tragedy, and I hope that in future revolutions nothing like that ever happens again. you'll be hard-pressed to find a leftist who does want millions of people to starve to death.
but blaming Stalin for the famine - especially saying he did it intentionally - has no basis in fact and makes you look like an ignorant buffoon.
If you like him enough to push apologism over his responsibility in causing the deaths of millions of people, then you clearly regard him as some kind of heroic figure, which is pretty sickening tbh. I'll make comparisons between Stalin and Hitler any day, because they were cut from the same cloth.
We sure do. But you're right, we need more great men hallowed in the halls of our regional holidays. I propose a Milton Friedman Day on his birthday, July 31st! Cheers for the suggestion Mis.
If rejecting peer-reviewed journals and academic evidence is "absolutely absurd"... then why do you reject literature reviews, peer-reviewed journals and academic evidence that proves that most of your economic talking points are total BS?
You're own freaking source admitted that Stalin let people die. Case closed, mate.
Stalin's a mass murderer even if you don't count the Holodomor. I'd like to see you make a case that the gulags and the Great Terror weren't real.
I have founded Mont Pelerin Society to discuss and debate libertarian ideals and human freedom, amongst other topics. I suggest we move this debate to there.
Guess I'm an ignorant buffoon. I can live with that.
you sure are!!! freeDUMB is for smelly poopheads
Hallo Island
Also,
Hey, while we're talking holidays, can we have an observance on June 26th for the Supreme Court ruling on gay marriage?
hey I found a place where you all would be fantastic workers!
http://i.imgur.com/Jx6EwuL.jpg
maybe we could build an orchard and then also build some dormitories and other facilities so you can just live there instead of having to commute? does that sound good? maybe put some barbed wire around the outside to keep hooligans out. just a thought
You are chairman make a suggestion
Do you just have that sitting on your imgur account or?
Can I hear some opinions on it?
If we observe that one, then I feel that we should observe other rulings, such as DC v Heller and Brown v Board of Education, that have been good for liberty.
I think it is about damn time it passed. And if it was a holiday then i would give it approval
Also a good idea
http://www.fbcommentpictures.com/media/images/2014/10/22/tmpmkzLkK.jpg
Hallo Island
Watching Rocky IV so pumped!!!!
Pevvania
Definitely the best Rocky. It's a fantastic film with a good theme and an excellent score.
Rockys Ranked
Rocky IV
Rocky III
Rocky VI
Rocky II
Rocky I
Rocky V
Oh the first rocky was my favorite but i love the fourth. I would say my second favorite
the best Rocky is the one y'all are gonna break into smaller Rockys after the revolution
Post self-deleted by Kings Island.
If I can change, and you can change, EVERYONE CAN CHANGE!
Pevvania
I thought we resolved this?
Hallo Island
We did. You guys apparently didn't.
What i am just quoting rocky
Pevvania
I watched Terminator Genisys today. I loved it. I give it a solid 7.5-8/10. It was quite rusty, as the dialogue wasn't great and it miscast Sarah Connor, but other than that I thought it was very good. The plot reinvigorated the franchise, and Arnie really shined in the role, as he has done for the past 30 years.
Oh i didn't care for it. It was really hard to follow and they didn't follow their own rules on time traveling consistently. Arnie was the only bright spot.
I'll admit, I had a little bit of hope last night, with regards to the fact that most of the conversation was rather gentlemanly and civil, then you blankly compare us to Holocaust deniers, not cool.
Okay then, let's change the subject.
What do you think of labour unions?
Points where points are due
ahaha, virtual slavery! i crack myself up sometimes.
okay then
The observance on the 26th of June has passed 4-1.
I'm gonna take a sabbatical. When the RMB spam is done I'll come back. I'm gonna try and help the Hyatt Island refugees. You know, something that actually matters. Something that helps out cause. Feeding trolls doesn't kill them. Shalom aleikhem.
We await your return
thank you. I'll see to it that you'll be provisioned already-smallish rocks after the revolution.
since I'm probably not going to check in before this embassy closes at the minor update: good afternoon, good evening, and goodnight.
Bye, bye, Libertatem!
rop
Bye guys
By
Noticed you guys were talking about the Rocky films, I have to say, this is probably my favourite moment of them all.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHNcAZYPY_E
Interesting to note though, I've just noticed that the version of the anthem they play is the 1944 version (ie, pre-de-stalinization, after Stalin's death, the lyrics were no longer sung, until new lyrics were written in 1977)
The last two lines of the chorus ('44, what was heard in Rocky IV):
Znamia sovetskoe, znamia narodnoe
Pust ot pobedy, k pobede vedet!
Translation: Banner of the Soviets, Banner of the people,
May it lead from victory to victory!
Last two lines, ('77)(ie, what should have been heard in Rocky IV):
Partiya Lenina - sila narodnaya
Nas k torzhestvu Kommunizma vedyot!
Translation: The Party of Lenin, the strength of the people,
Leads us to the triumph of Communism!
By the time of film's release in '85, the new lyrics would have been in wide use, so I'm wondering if there's any particular reason for this, or perhaps if this is just an error on the moviemakers' part.
I guess it depends on the situation, they are well past their heyday that's for sure, but they had a big impact on the quality of workers in this part of the world (Ireland and UK), I don't know much about them in the US though. I'd like to hear your two pence on them first.
Happy birthday, RWN!
Yeah, screw off.
Could you say there is a personality cult?
NO! I will leave politely. Toodaloo Libertatemites!
Hello! What is all your opinions on the presidential candidates?
Rand, no doubt.
Miencraft
Awwwwww love you humpy!!!!!!!
Yeah rand, but if he doesn't make it then i will vote for Trump for the hell of it. And then if trump isn't around, then i don't know
All of em will betray their principles the minute they get into office.
Even Bernie Sanders and Rand Paul would. Trust me.
They're politicians.
I really want to see if we can get an inanimate object the nomination and see how much Hillary butt it kicks.
It would make me happy
I'm voting for myself, gonna write "MUH ROADS" all over the ballot.
i don't know man. gonna have to consult the reagan purity test.
Well obviously
You got it hombre
Goddam the Hawks are annoying mofos.
Rand vs Bernie would be amazing.
Well it looks like The Black Riders aren't dead after all.
Smh
Whats some regional history?
i blame greatergermanregions for not staying. good job man.
Republic Of Minerva
unitedgermanregions, whatever.
Okay - I admit it. I'm out of the closet. I am a beltway libertarian.
There, are you guys happy now?
I do suppose intentional mass murder is 100% okay, as long as it's possible that you're not targeting a specific ethnic group.
#equality
#massmurder4everybody
Pevvania
Wow, and here I thought we had dropped all this.
The only form of marriage that has been explicitly ordained of God has been marriage between one man and one woman. There is no scriptural basis for homosexual marriage, and there are plenty of verses in the New Testament that show homosexuality in a negative light.
Because no marriages outside of those of the heterosexual, monogamous variety are actually divinely ordained, any other kind of romantic relationship is fornication - plain and simple. Those who live the homosexual lifestyle, regardless of if they're "married" or not, are committing a grievous sin, indeed. Verily, the sin of fornication; one that is a common stumbling block for many, regardless of sexual orientation.
See, people? This is what it should be like.
TNUS, I disagree with you, but respect tour entitlement to free thought and opinions.
No name calling, no disrespect. And now if TNUS were to try to disagree, we could civilly debate and not compete in a pissing match.
Dude you are suppose to be a libertarian
Pevvania
I'm not a libertarian, because I don't think that homosexual marriages are ordained of God?
Where did I say anything about the state or my thoughts on its role in marriage?
Assembled with Dot's Region Saver.
Written by Refuge Isle.