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Region: Libertatem

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Can someone explain to me the concept of a voluntary society?

Humpy: The Tammy of Libertatem.

Conservative Idealism In Libertatem wrote:*speaks with some sort of liberal-sounding voice* Sure it is! The Preamble says "promote the general welfare" and that means Obamacare is good for you

Section 8, Subsection I explicitly mentions that "The Congress shall have the power to [...] provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States", but James Madison later explained that in the context of this section, 'general welfare' means in relation to defending the country from attack and other very general functions for the government. He also said that if the General Welfare Clause were to give such broad powers to the Congress then there would have been no need for a list of enumerated powers. Government welfare usually only benefits very specific individuals, groups and special interests, so it violates the entire concept of equality under the law that the Constitution was built on. So welfare is indeed unconstitutional.

Also, Obamacare is often justified by liberals as covered under the Commerce Clause. But even a very loose interpretation of the clause shows that this is not true. At least, Congress has the power to regulate trade between the states and not within them, and at most if Congress has the power to regulate all commerce, which it does not, it still cannot compel commerce. And since Obamacare is a set of mandates designed to compel commerce, it is unconstitutional on both fronts.

The Amarican Empire wrote:Humpy: The Tammy of Libertatem.

Yup.

Pevvania wrote:Section 8, Subsection I explicitly mentions that "The Congress shall have the power to [...] provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States", but James Madison later explained that in the context of this section, 'general welfare' means in relation to defending the country from attack and other very general functions for the government. He also said that if the General Welfare Clause were to give such broad powers to the Congress then there would have been no need for a list of enumerated powers. Government welfare usually only benefits very specific individuals, groups and special interests, so it violates the entire concept of equality under the law that the Constitution was built on. So welfare is indeed unconstitutional.

Also, Obamacare is often justified by liberals as covered under the Commerce Clause. But even a very loose interpretation of the clause shows that this is not true. At least, Congress has the power to regulate trade between the states and not within them, and at most if Congress has the power to regulate all commerce, which it does not, it still cannot compel commerce. And since Obamacare is a set of mandates designed to compel commerce, it is unconstitutional on both fronts.

if only the us supreme court felt that way.

Pevvania wrote:Section 8, Subsection I explicitly mentions that...

Silly Pev, thinking that the government can limit itself because of a piece of paper

So uh, the Russians fired at Ukrainian rebels and killed nineteen of them

Right-Winged Nation wrote:So uh, the Russians fired at Ukrainian rebels and killed nineteen of them

Good.

Albenia wrote:Good.

First, you support a Holodomor denying communist (V Ming) and now you support the Russian takeover of Ukraine?!

Wow, just wow. I wouldn't be surprised if you founded the "Genocide Party".

The Neo-Confederate States Of America wrote:First, you support a Holodomor denying communist (V Ming) and now you support the Russian takeover of Ukraine?!

Wow, just wow. I wouldn't be surprised if you founded the "Genocide Party".

Russia is achieving Humanitarian Aid in the Ukrainian Crisis by attempting to get the East which voted Numerous times to join Russia.

And now I wanna found that party...

And now I wanna found that party...

To be fair, the vast majority of Crimeans were Russian descent, and regardless of the corruption or tampering of the polls, it is clear that a sizable majority wanted to be apart of Russia. Still, I dislike Putin as much as I dislike EU federalism, and would prefer if they went to war only to destroy each other.

The Neo-Confederate States Of America wrote:First, you support a Holodomor denying communist (V Ming) and now you support the Russian takeover of Ukraine?!

Wow, just wow. I wouldn't be surprised if you founded the "Genocide Party".

Coincidence? I...THINK...NOT!!!!!

Lack There Of wrote:Silly Pev, thinking that the government can limit itself because of a piece of paper

I was just making the point that welfare from the federal government is illegal.

Pevvania wrote:I was just making the point that welfare from the federal government is illegal.

Good point

Pevvania wrote:I was just making the point that welfare from the federal government is illegal.

Well, obviously not, but it is unconstitutional.

Does this concern anyone that Russia is trying to take over Ukraine?

Right-Winged Nation wrote:Does this concern anyone that Russia is trying to take over Ukraine?

why should I be concerned about something I support?

Albenia wrote:why should I be concerned about something I support?

Exactly why do support Russia trying to take control of Ukraine?

Right-Winged Nation wrote:Exactly why do support Russia trying to take control of Ukraine?

The east voted to join Russia in Multiple Referendums. The west won't let them. So Putin is simply completing Democratic process.

Albenia wrote:The east voted to join Russia in Multiple Referendums. The west won't let them. So Putin is simply completing Democratic process.

Putin hasn't any jurisdiction to complete democratic process outside of his nation; not that he ever cared about democracy anyways.

Albenia wrote:The east voted to join Russia in Multiple Referendums. The west won't let them. So Putin is simply completing Democratic process.

Ukraine is no longer under the jurisdiction of Russia and therefore Russia has no place in attempting to override their independence; if some part of Ukraine chooses to secede from the rest and join Russia as an independent thought, then that's theirs to decide. Otherwise, Russia should not be attempting to take Ukraine. They do have a legitimate claim on it in that it used to be Soviet territory, but the Soviet nation no longer exists, so they have no place there.

Godisdead wrote:Putin hasn't any jurisdiction to complete democratic process outside of his nation; not that he ever cared about democracy anyways.

Of course he does. If the sovereign government of a nation does not recognize a referendum/democratic process done by the citizens. Then another has duties to protect said Referendum and democratic process.

Albenia wrote:Of course he does. If the sovereign government of a nation does not recognize a referendum/democratic process done by the citizens. Then another has duties to protect said Referendum and democratic process.

If the sovereign government of a nation does not recognize the legitimacy of a referendum, then that's the end of that.

Albenia wrote:Of course he does. If the sovereign government of a nation does not recognize a referendum/democratic process done by the citizens. Then another has duties to protect said Referendum and democratic process.

A country's duties don't extend out of its borders.

Miencraft wrote:; if some part of Ukraine chooses to secede from the rest and join Russia as an independent thought, then

east Ukraine's Referendums.

Miencraft wrote:If the sovereign government of a nation does not recognize the legitimacy of a referendum, then that's the end of that.

The Government may not fight the will of the people.

Godisdead wrote:A country's duties don't extend out of its borders.

So how about that American and Middle East stuff?

Albenia wrote:The Government may not fight the will of the people.

Who says other governments abide by that? Who says anyone else has to get involved?

Albenia wrote:east Ukraine's Referendums.

Such things do not give the Russians a casus belli against Ukraine. Their military presence their is uncalled for and unjustified.

Not to mention the current Government of Ukraine was installed via revolution and is not a Legitimate government.

Albenia wrote:Not to mention the current Government of Ukraine was installed via revolution and is not a Legitimate government.

The American government was installed via revolution and therefore is illegitimate.

Miencraft wrote:Who says other governments abide by that? Who says anyone else has to get involved?

Such things do not give the Russians a casus belli against Ukraine. Their military presence their is uncalled for and unjustified.

1. It doesn't matter where it is. The people take priority over the government politically and socially.

2. I have to go.

Albenia wrote:It doesn't matter where it is. The people take priority over the government politically and socially.

Yes. Yes it does.

Some places are controlled by extremely powerful military dictators who will stamp out independent thought wherever it happens to come up and leave the people too scared/dead/otherwise incapacitated and thus unable to do anything to change their way of life.

Miencraft wrote:Yes. Yes it does.

Some places are controlled by extremely powerful military dictators who will stamp out independent thought wherever it happens to come up and leave the people too scared/dead/otherwise incapacitated and thus unable to do anything to change their way of life.

Yep, that's the nature of coups.

>Western Ukraine and the rest of the EU invade Russia

>America sits back, finances the West's war effort, and watches

And everyone lives happily ever after.

Rotgeheim wrote:>Western Ukraine and the rest of the EU invade Russia

>America sits back, finances the West's war effort, and watches

And everyone lives happily ever after.

I'd rather we just sit and watch, personally. Ain't any of our business until they start going after us.

Miencraft wrote:I'd rather we just sit and watch, personally. Ain't any of our business until they start going after us.

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." - Edmund Burke

Rotgeheim wrote:"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." - Edmund Burke

"If we just sit back and watch as the world around us burns, we'll notice that we're the only ones who come out unscathed. Why? Because we never stepped into the fire. I bet all those idiots that did are dead now." ~Me, just now.

Miencraft wrote:"If we just sit back and watch as the world around us burns, we'll notice that we're the only ones who come out unscathed. Why? Because we never stepped into the fire. I bet all those idiots that did are dead now." ~Me, just now.

That's honestly quite selfish behavior. Self-preservation is important, but you shouldn't let your friends and allies fall while you sit back and observe.

Is it right to let your friend burn up in the fire that another nation created while you sit back and observe?

Rotgeheim wrote:That's honestly quite selfish behavior. Self-preservation is important, but you shouldn't let your friends and allies fall while you sit back and observe.

It was a joke, mostly. I don't quote myself like that if I'm being serious.

Why not profit off of others, or do you want them to have FREE stuff.

Miencraft wrote:It was a joke, mostly. I don't quote myself like that if I'm being serious.

I didn't take that seriously, just to let you know. I was just throwing my opinion out there while I could.

That moment when I get a telegram from some person asking for puppets because their main nation got banned.

So, uh, watch out for that, even if it's incredibly stupid and no person with half a brain would fall for it.

Post self-deleted by Miencraft.

Also, they quietly added an option for plural demonyms. Still waiting for plural currency and national animal...

Miencraft wrote:Also, they quietly added an option for plural demonyms. Still waiting for plural currency and national animal...

I actually like this setting a lot. It always frustrated me when they said "Rotgeheimian" rather than my preferred demonym.

Rotgeheim wrote:I actually like this setting a lot. It always frustrated me when they said "Rotgeheimian" rather than my preferred demonym.

I like how they say "The hard-nosed, hard-working, intelligent population of 5.768 billion Miencraftie live in a state of perpetual fear"

*clears throat*

Given that "of" is a preposition, "of 5.768 billion Miencraftie" can be ignored.

Also, the adjectives that modify "population" can also be ignored.

"The population live in a state of perpetual fear"

Since "population" is singular, that's a grammatically incorrect sentence you've got there, Barry.

"If I didn't have a sense of humor, how could I stand this trial now?"

- Hermann Göring, during the Nuremburg War Crimes Trials

I thought that was funny, in a dry sort of way.

Rotgeheim wrote:"If I didn't have a sense of humor, how could I stand this trial now?"

- Hermann Göring, during the Nuremburg War Crimes Trials

I thought that was funny, in a dry sort of way.

Wow, That really is dry.

Godisdead wrote:Wow, That really is dry.

I'm reading a bit on him during the trials. He, among many others (on both sides, too) really believed the charges he got were ridiculous.

Rotgeheim wrote:I'm reading a bit on him during the trials. He, among many others (on both sides, too) really believed the charges he got were ridiculous.

If I remember correctly, he didn't believe anything for long. Unlike Albert Speer, aka the nazi who said sorry.

Godisdead wrote:If I remember correctly, he didn't believe anything for long. Unlike Albert Speer, aka the nazi who said sorry.

"You killed Jews!"

"Sorry..."

Republic Of Minerva wrote:"You killed Jews!"

"Sorry..."

.....Yes.

If that's how he said it. I love him....

Albenia wrote:.....Yes.

If that's how he said it. I love him....

Speer was the Minister of Armaments and War Production, he didn't murder anyone.

Rotgeheim wrote:Speer was the Minister of Armaments and War Production, he didn't murder anyone.

He's awesome.

Rotgeheim wrote:Speer was the Minister of Armaments and War Production, he didn't murder anyone.

Actually, he was the architect.

Godisdead wrote:Actually, he was the architect.

He was a professional architect, yes, but he was still the Minister of Armaments and War Production.

Interestingly enough, his son went on to become an architect as well.

Rotgeheim wrote:He was a professional architect, yes, but he was still the Minister of Armaments and War Production.

Interestingly enough, his son went on to become an architect as well.

Well, yeah.

http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_07_11/Putin-writes-off-90-percent-of-Cubas-debts-to-USSR-2434/

Good Putin.

Godisdead wrote:http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_07_11/Putin-writes-off-90-percent-of-Cubas-debts-to-USSR-2434/

Good Putin.

"He isn't a bad guy, he's just misunderstood."

- No one

Rotgeheim wrote:"He isn't a bad guy, he's just misunderstood."

- No one

This is the only decent thing I have seen him do.

Rotgeheim wrote:"He isn't a bad guy, he's just misunderstood."

- No one

Also, have you seen Downfall?

Godisdead wrote:http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_07_11/Putin-writes-off-90-percent-of-Cubas-debts-to-USSR-2434/

Good Putin.

Waiddaminitherr

If 3.5 billion is 10%

They erased ~32 billion dollars in debt.

I smell ulterior motives.

Miencraft wrote:Waiddaminitherr

If 3.5 billion is 10%

They erased ~32 billion dollars in debt.

I smell ulterior motives.

Of course. But now Cuba isn't in debt, so I am sure they are grateful.

Godisdead wrote:Also, have you seen Downfall?

I've seen it about four times, yes. It helps me train my German listening skills as well as it just being a darn good movie.

Rotgeheim wrote:I've seen it about four times, yes. It helps me train my German listening skills as well as it just being a darn good movie.

That movie was damned excellent. I'm learning German as well.

Godisdead wrote:That movie was damned excellent. I'm learning German as well.

Wie viel deutsch hast du gelernt? Und auch wo hast du sie gelernt? Ich lerne sie noch in der Schule.

Godisdead wrote:That movie was damned excellent. I'm learning German as well.

I thought it was interesting that the voice actors for the German forces in Call of Duty: World at War were cast in this film. Maybe that's where Treyarch drew their inspiration for high-pitched, screaming German soldiers from.

Rotgeheim wrote:Wie viel deutsch hast du gelernt? Und auch wo hast du sie gelernt? Ich lerne sie noch in der Schule.

Ich habe gelernt etwa vierhundert Worte so weit und ich habe von einer Website namens Duolingo Lernen worden. Ich wünschte, meine Schule unterrichtet Deutsch.

Rotgeheim wrote:I thought it was interesting that the voice actors for the German forces in Call of Duty: World at War were cast in this film. Maybe that's where Treyarch drew their inspiration for high-pitched, screaming German soldiers from.

Das ist sehr interessant!

I am also decent with German, but did the last sentence say " I wish my school had German"?

Godisdead wrote:Ich habe gelernt etwa vierhundert Worte so weit und ich habe von einer Website namens Duolingo Lernen worden. Ich wünschte, meine Schule unterrichtet Deutsch.

Deine Schule scheint mir rückwärts. Jede Schule muss deutsch lehren! Deutsch ist eine Sprache der Wirtschaft, der Zukunft!

Northern Prussia wrote:I am also decent with German, but did the last sentence say " I wish my school had German"?

Yes, it did.

Yep this will be a rough year for me, no German 4.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qANdxpwCWWg

At 1:40 a battle scene commences. The man with the mustache and the camo cover on his helmet is one of the voice actors from the Call of Duty games set during WWII.

" what do you mean I've retreated! I'm 100 meters from the front line!"

"Jede Kontakt zum rücken Fallschirmjäger ist abgebrochen."

I don't know how helpful they would have been during the Battle of Berlin anyway.

Like Goebells Volksarmeii?

Godisdead wrote:http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_07_11/Putin-writes-off-90-percent-of-Cubas-debts-to-USSR-2434/

Good Putin.

YAY PUTIN!

"Wo kommt die denn her?!"

"Volkssturm! Heute Nachmittag zugeschaltet!"

"Was? Wie soll ich raus dort?"

"Brigadeführer, sie sind Volkssturm! Unter liegt es direkt dem Befehl des Dr. Goebbels!"

I would be angry at that point, if I was the Brigadeführer.

I really want to learn German, but I couldn't even learn Spanish so :|

Republic Of Minerva wrote:I really want to learn German, but I couldn't even learn Spanish so :|

https://www.duolingo.com/

Use this.

Godisdead wrote:https://www.duolingo.com/

Use this.

Interesting. Will test it out later.

For now. *skimask*

Republic Of Minerva wrote:Interesting. Will test it out later.

For now. *skimask*

Is that skimask for what I think it is? *winks*

Godisdead wrote:Is that skimask for what I think it is? *winks*

Republic Of Minerva wrote:Interesting. Will test it out later.

For now. *skimask*

Stop this, the both of you. It's about to go down a bad road.

Rotgeheim wrote:Stop this, the both of you. It's about to go down a bad road.

No, it wasn't.

Godisdead wrote:No, it wasn't.

Yes, it was. Do I have to lock you two in a box?

Rotgeheim wrote:Yes, it was. Do I have to lock you two in a box?

Um... no.

Godisdead wrote:Um... no.

I'll do it, I swear.

I wanna be locked in a box...

Rotgeheim wrote:I'll do it, I swear.

*wimpers*

Albenia wrote:I wanna be locked in a box...

Dude... no..

Albenia wrote:I wanna be locked in a box...

I'll throw all three of you in there!

[B]Ich werde euch in eine Kiste stecken, und den Schlüssel wegwerfen![/B]

German just sounds so menacing when you threaten someone.

Godisdead wrote:Dude... no..

....Yes!

Rotgeheim wrote:I'll throw all three of you in there!

[B]Ich werde euch in eine Kiste stecken, und den Schlüssel wegwerfen![/B]

German just sounds so menacing when you threaten someone.

...I'm fine with that.

Albenia wrote:...I'm fine with that.

Quit, Dammit!

Godisdead wrote:Quit, Dammit!

What?

Und dann das Feuer beginnt! Die Flammen lecken auf die Seiten, kochen was innen ist. Euer Körpern werden verbrannt sein!

Rotgeheim wrote:Und dann das Feuer beginnt! Die Flammen lecken auf die Seiten, kochen was innen ist. Euer Körpern werden verbrannt sein!

Wait? You'll burn us?

Rotgeheim wrote:Und dann das Feuer beginnt! Die Flammen lecken auf die Seiten, kochen was innen ist. Euer Körpern werden verbrannt sein!

Das klingt absolut erschreckend. Auch ist eine Fotze TTA.

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Written by Refuge Isle.