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Region: Libertatem

History

Miencraft wrote:It's a big desk, man. And you can join in if you want.

Like I said, I'm already down here, as are the other usual seven (minus Humphy).

Conservative Idealism In Libertatem wrote:Like I said, I'm already down here, as are the other usual seven (minus Humphy).

Oh, you haven't found the trapdoor? You should find it, there's plenty of room in that dungeon.

Miencraft wrote:Oh, you haven't found the trapdoor? You should find it, there's plenty of room in that dungeon.

Trapdoor? Is it this knob under your chair? ...Nope, that's definitely not it.

*the remaining scenes in this "movie" could not be found*

Pax Osca wrote:Question:

Would you Libertarians argue your economic policy increases or decreases income inequality?

Well I'm more neocon than libertarian, but considering that under reaganomics the poverty rate dropped every year from 1984 to 1989 while at the same time rich got richer. So you could say it increased "inequality" but why would that even matter if everyone was getting less poor? And more jobs being made?

Pevvania wrote:It depends. Generally we aren't concerned about 'benign' income inequality, i.e. when an economy grows helping everyone, with the rich generating wralt faster as a result of market processes. However, there doesn't seem to be much evidence of this happening. Many of us, including myself, are concerned about income inequality resulting from government cronyism, such as in African countries where the state redistributes wealth from the bottom of society to government officials and cronies. We are also concerned about racial income inequality, which has growed significantly since 2000.

But to answer your question, though we don't tend to discuss remedies to issues that we see as being nonexistent, some of us have suggested our policies would decrease income inequality. For example, pension privatisation would make workers rich and poor owners of capital, something which a lot of rich people already do but not many lower-income workers do. So it would slightly bridge the gap. Removing marriage penalisations in the welfare system - which some have argued has accounted for as much as 30% of the income inequality increases in the last 50 years - would take many people out of poverty and decrease inequalities. And needless to say, school choice is a big thing that would give poor kids the same chance as rich kids to achieve.

Hmm.

I'm not quite sure where you get the idea that privatizing education would get the poor the same choices as the rich - luxury products is a thing even in education - but that's a different topic for another time.

My question was largely there as a precursor to the not-insubstantial evidence that your, to use your term, 'benign' inequality is... well... not particularly benign - purely economically speaking. A few articles came to my attention lately, par example:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/06/upshot/alarm-on-income-inequality-from-a-mainstream-source.html?_r=0&abt=0002&abg=0

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/02/26/uk-imf-inequality-idUKBREA1P1PH20140226

http://www.dw.de/oecd-finds-increasing-inequality-lowers-growth/a-18117168

Take note the second section of the last article for instance: while I understand how you argue that financial savings benefit small businesses (through cheaper loans, etc), demand for products is in many ways even more important - and something that can be generated through giving the poorer classes a greater disposable income via, for instance, a scaling income tax.

Pax Osca wrote:Question:

Would you Libertarians argue your economic policy increases or decreases income inequality?

Grab bag - solving inequality isn't as much a priority as ensuring the average living standards improve for everyone. It's better to be a poor man today than a rich man 200 years ago, I'd say.

Conservative Idealism In Libertatem wrote:Trapdoor? Is it this knob under your chair? ...Nope, that's definitely not it.

*the remaining scenes in this "movie" could not be found*

'Tatem: implying porn since 2014.

Miencraft wrote:'Tatem: implying porn since 2014.

We've been at it a little longer than that, I think.

Conservative Idealism In Libertatem wrote:Grab bag - solving inequality isn't as much a priority as ensuring the average living standards improve for everyone. It's better to be a poor man today than a rich man 200 years ago, I'd say.

Depends by what measure you're going.

A rich man 200 years ago could always afford a good meal whenever he/she wished, a poor person today? Not a guarantee for those on the poverty line.

I would like to submit a WA Proposal. Could I get 2 WA members to endorse me please? Thank you.

Conservative Idealism In Libertatem wrote:We've been at it a little longer than that, I think.

Kay, fine, 2012.

Post self-deleted by Miencraft.

Shermaniya wrote:I would like to submit a WA Proposal. Could I get 2 WA members to endorse me please? Thank you.

There's one for you.

I might even endorse it for queue if it's good enough.

And I also remind you to send it through the forum first to make sure it's all legal and stuff if you haven't already.

Anyway, I'm off, TG me if you can be bothered to reply X) No worries if not :P

Miencraft wrote:There's one for you.

I might even endorse it for queue if it's good enough.

And I also remind you to send it through the forum first to make sure it's all legal and stuff if you haven't already.

Thanks. I'll post it now on the forum.

Pax Osca wrote:Question:

Would you Libertarians argue your economic policy increases or decreases income inequality?

Not a Libertarian here but in a functional society there must be a rich and a poor.

The State Of Deseret wrote:Not a Libertarian here but in a functional society there must be a rich and a poor.

In theory. Just because we've chosen to divide ourselves into classes doesn't mean they're explicitly necessary.

Conservative Idealism In Libertatem wrote:In theory. Just because we've chosen to divide ourselves into classes doesn't mean they're explicitly necessary.

Maybe not, but they are inevitable; Everyone here knows what happens when you reject that fact and equalize everyone. They'll happen, not much we can really do about that.

And really, Board guys, please, I need to have your elections and the Presidential ones and account for Pevvania Day and Christmas and get up to 5 days of Board elections plus the three-day Presidential ones done by the end of the month. We have, like, next week and a bit of the week after that, so please do announce if you're running. Just makes it easier to plan everything.

I mean, we could technically do the Presidential things on the last three days of the month and take Christmas week off, but that still leaves next week to do everything else. So please do get to the thing that you need to do.

Pevvania Day is the 14th, and our government would need to take time off on the 24th and 25th at the very least. Maybe we could hold the Presidential elections on the 15th through 17th, and the Board elections from the 18th to the 22nd, and then begin the Christmas break on the 23rd?

Conservative Idealism In Libertatem wrote:Pevvania Day is the 14th, and our government would need to take time off on the 24th and 25th at the very least. Maybe we could hold the Presidential elections on the 15th through 17th, and the Board elections from the 18th to the 22nd, and then begin the Christmas break on the 23rd?

The Board will be voting on the Christmas Recess of Government happening between the 20th-26th. This is simply precautionary, the region goes on lockdown and people can go to their families. The elections are going to be held the 15th-17th. That allotts three Board elections. I doubt that more than three will go up, but if they do, we would have 5 days to do it after Christmas.

Taylor Swift will be mine...

The State Of Deseret wrote:Not a Libertarian here but in a functional society there must be a rich and a poor.

Why?

Pevvania wrote:Why?

It's my personal rule of law...

In any society there will be a rich and a Poor.

Both serve purposes...

Humpheria wrote:The Board will be voting on the Christmas Recess of Government happening between the 20th-26th. This is simply precautionary, the region goes on lockdown and people can go to their families. The elections are going to be held the 15th-17th. That allotts three Board elections. I doubt that more than three will go up, but if they do, we would have 5 days to do it after Christmas.

The Debate is on the 16th, voting should be done on the 17th right?

I'll be candidate for my reelection to board seat 1.

Right-Winged Nation wrote:The Debate is on the 16th, voting should be done on the 17th right?

I suppose. The 17th-20th. We can hold the Board elections after Christmas.

Humpheria wrote:I suppose. The 17th-20th. We can hold the Board elections after Christmas.

Okay

Yrellian Confederacy wrote:UK's conservative party is the only one in Europe to have a " libertarian " economic program. In fact, most of the time you have the choice between : social-democrats or moderate leftists = statists, and liberal-conservatives = less statists.

The CDU ( Germany ) and PP ( Spain ) are quite statists despite what you can hear on Merkel, and the UMP ( France ) and FI ( Italy ) are far away from any kind of economic libertarianism.

There are some good libertarian leaning parties in Switzerland and Austria, but that's all.

Yrellian Confederacy wrote:I totally forgot Estonia, where some very good progresses have been accomplished, and even Sweden where the right reduced the public expenses from 72% to 54% of the GDP, while saving the country's finances and introducing competition in a lot of former state monopolies.

Pevvania wrote:Indeed, Eastern and Northern European countries have had pretty good records on economic reform.

*grumbles*.... stupid foreigners.

Post self-deleted by Kanatistan.

Post self-deleted by Kanatistan.

Post self-deleted by Kanatistan.

Some The Hobbit fans here ?

Kanatistan wrote:It is offensive to me because of what I hope are obvious reasons. I just wonder how you mix those ideas?

The principal said it was an honest mistake so I am still pissed... America sucks.

...No...I don't know the reasons...me and a Muslim friend invented it.

Ummm we took the Pillars of Islam and the Articles of Faith and Mixed them a bit.

Now to the real reason I quoted you. AMERICA DOES NOT SUCK. AMERICA IS ONE OF THE BEST COUNTRIES IN THE WORLD TODAY. IT'S NOT MY FAULT NOR AMERICA'S FAULT PEOPLE HERE ARE AT TIMES IGNORANT. BUT HOW DARE YOU SAY BECAUSE OF A FEW INTOLERANT PEOPLE THAT MY COUNTRY SUCKS.

If I do not attain a Manager position after the Presidential election is over (seeing as I have not requested one, that would be quite likely), then I will run for Board Seat Three.

The State Of Deseret wrote:...No...I don't know the reasons...me and a Muslim friend invented it.

Ummm we took the Pillars of Islam and the Articles of Faith and Mixed them a bit.

Now to the real reason I quoted you. AMERICA DOES NOT SUCK. AMERICA IS ONE OF THE BEST COUNTRIES IN THE WORLD TODAY. IT'S NOT MY FAULT NOR AMERICA'S FAULT PEOPLE HERE ARE AT TIMES IGNORANT. BUT HOW DARE YOU SAY BECAUSE OF A FEW INTOLERANT PEOPLE THAT MY COUNTRY SUCKS.

ARE YOU GOING TO SEND HIM SOME FREEDOM ?

Yrellian Confederacy wrote:ARE YOU GOING TO SEND HIM SOME FREEDOM ?

Doesn't deserve it.

Hey. I'm back, again, if anyone remembers me.

That I do. Weren't you once our military affairs guy?

Anyway, welcome back.

By the way, I like your new flag. How long have you had it?

Actum wrote:Hey. I'm back, again, if anyone remembers me.

You don't remember me, but I remember you.

Conservative Idealism In Libertatem wrote:That I do. Weren't you once our military affairs guy?

Anyway, welcome back.

Yeah, I was once the Military Affairs guy.

Conservative Idealism In Libertatem wrote:By the way, I like your new flag. How long have you had it?

I got it just a few days ago.

Miencraft wrote:You don't remember me, but I remember you.

I actually do remember you Miencraft.

Just performed at the Phoenix Theatre. Kicked ass.

Welcome back, Actum! Nice to see you round here again.

Post self-deleted by Kanatistan.

Conservative Idealism In Libertatem wrote:By the way, I like your new flag. How long have you had it?

Actum wrote:

I got it just a few days ago.

This is the Brian Boru's harp, isn't it ?

So you're probably Irish ?

I visited Dublin in early september, very nice city, and I saw this famous harp in Trinity College.

Still miss the Irish breakfast.

Actum wrote:I actually do remember you Miencraft.

Well, stop it.

Post self-deleted by Kanatistan.

Kanatistan wrote:Wait a minute. So I am not deserving of freedom because I disagree with you? So then is America free? Are you free? If I have to conform then I am not free and thus no one else would be just because they would become conformists, which are not truly free.

I quite like America. It's made mistakes, but overall it's been a force of good in the world. Up until the War on Terror.

Post self-deleted by Kanatistan.

Are Russia and Guyana allies?

Kanatistan wrote:Wait a minute. So I am not deserving of freedom because I disagree with you? So then is America free? Are you free? If I have to conform then I am not free and thus no one else would be just because they would become conformists, which are not truly free.

1. It was a joke pal.

2. It is pretty free yes.

3. Last I checked I was.

4. I don't conform...

Shermaniya wrote:Are Russia and Guyana allies?

Nope...

Kanatistan wrote:America is the worst because they say they are the best. They dece who is worthy of freedom and allow dictatorships and genocide to happen so long as their interests are met. They allowed south Vietnam to kill Buddhists, Turkey to harm the Kurds, Saudi Arabia to restrict freedoms, and racism to take place in Africa.

And? they are not my government's problems. I elected my government to make my life better. Not a South African's.

Yrellian Confederacy wrote:This is the Brian Boru's harp, isn't it ?

So you're probably Irish ?

I visited Dublin in early september, very nice city, and I saw this famous harp in Trinity College.

Still miss the Irish breakfast.

This is Brian Boru's harp. I'm Irish-American by the way.

Kanatistan wrote:I support the war on terroR but also support the soviet Union in the Cold War, somewhat Hussein, and Ho Chi Minh.

I have to ask, why do you like living in Libertatem?

Actum wrote:I have to ask, why do you like living in Libertatem?

Implying only non-Statists reside here.

Lemme let you in on a secret. Economically I am the most statist person I know of here besides Pax.

The State Of Deseret wrote:Implying only non-Statists reside here.

Lemme let you in on a secret. Economically I am the most statist person I know of here besides Pax.

What I meant was that if you support Communism, why would you want to live in an anti-communist region?

Actum wrote:What I meant was that if you support Communism, why would you want to live in an anti-communist region?

we are accepting of all ideologies and we really are only against Statist Commies.

The State Of Deseret wrote:we are accepting of all ideologies and we really are only against Statist Commies.

Aren't you in a different region?

Actum wrote:Aren't you in a different region?

...Meh. I have large ties to the region...came here in January back when I was Marxist...these guys found my fallacies and made me more Centrist economically.

The State Of Deseret wrote:we are accepting of all ideologies and we really are only against Statist Commies.

And I am pretty sure that The USSR and Ho Chi Mihn qualify as statist commies.

Actum wrote:And I am pretty sure that The USSR and Ho Chi Mihn qualify as statist commies.

...STATE SOCIALIST.

Look. I've explained it once. Social Democracy, Democratic Socialism, State Socialism, Communism, Libertarian Socialism and Anrxho-Communism are not the samr.

You are saying that the USSR and Vietnam are not communist?

I support the war on terror if it doesn't involve large scale military operations that destabilize Whole regions. I support the use of drones, and covert operations, rather use of large armies. Also I encourage the cooperation of the affected nation to combat terrorism.

Actum wrote:You are saying that the USSR and Vietnam are not communist?

Last I checked Communism was Proletariat ran Direct Democracy. Either centralized or not...

Niether of those were thay. They were State Socialist.

The State Of Deseret wrote:Last I checked Communism was Proletariat ran Direct Democracy. Either centralized or not...

Niether of those were thay. They were State Socialist.

Yep, common mistake.

All right, I concede the point. I would still think that state socialism is opposed by this region then, being that we are a libertarian capitalist region.

Actum wrote:All right, I concede the point. I would still think that state socialism is opposed by this region then, being that we are a libertarian capitalist region.

In this you are correct.

That is why it seems strange to me that someone supporting state socialism (or Communism) would want to make their home here.

Hey guys, you should check out "Sons of Liberty" by Frank Turner. It is a great libertarian song.

Actum wrote:That is why it seems strange to me that someone supporting state socialism (or Communism) would want to make their home here.

He changes ideologies every week or so.

Republic Of Minerva wrote:He changes ideologies every week or so.

Sounds like me

Could I get another endorsement so that I can submit my resolution proposal.

http://rt.com/news/213483-cia-torture-country-scandal/

Republic Of Minerva wrote:He changes ideologies every week or so.
that's a lie I'm sick of hearing.

I've changed my economic policy Twice. And that's it.

If all you know how to do is spread lie after lie I'm not going to take part in anything having to do with youn

Actum wrote:That is why it seems strange to me that someone supporting state socialism (or Communism) would want to make their home here.

Fair enough.

The State Of Deseret wrote:that's a lie I'm sick of hearing.

I've changed my economic policy Twice. And that's it.

If all you know how to do is spread lie after lie I'm not going to take part in anything having to do with youn

It's literally a joke at this point. It's fun. Just roll with it.

Miencraft wrote:It's literally a joke at this point. It's fun. Just roll with it.

*Mumbles under breath*

...Fine.

I'm actually wishing to look into anarchy some more.

What is the ideal way to being the Government down?

I like your flag, TTA.

Humpheria wrote:I like your flag, TTA.

Only reasonable Anarchist ideology I could find.

Transhumanist Anarchism. The view Anarchism and freedom can't be achieved by humanity in its current state and that Humans must change before full freedom is possible.

The State Of Deseret wrote:Only reasonable Anarchist ideology I could find.

Transhumanist Anarchism. The view Anarchism and freedom can't be achieved by humanity in its current state and that Humans must change before full freedom is possible.

I just meant that I liked the colors, geez.

Humpheria wrote:I just meant that I liked the colors, geez.

Oh...Hahaha

Post self-deleted by Kanatistan.

The State Of Deseret wrote:that's a lie I'm sick of hearing.

I've changed my economic policy Twice. And that's it.

If all you know how to do is spread lie after lie I'm not going to take part in anything having to do with youn

You have to admit is it kind of funny that since this argument has been going on you have changed your nation title and flag.

Actum wrote:You have to admit is it kind of funny that since this argument has been going on you have changed your nation title and flag.

I like this guy! Welcome back, Actum.

Kanatistan wrote:Well... As I see I am, very different here...

You may be, but so are a lot of other people here. We all may be different, but that is what's great about Libertatem, we all don't have to agree.

Humpheria wrote:You may be, but so are a lot of other people here. We all may be different, but that is what's great about Libertatem, we all don't have to agree.

Unlike alotta commie regions...

Dang centralization Democratic process....

Actum wrote:You have to admit is it kind of funny that since this argument has been going on you have changed your nation title and flag.

Why?

The State Of Deseret wrote:Unlike alotta commie regions...

Dang centralization Democratic process....Why?

You want some? You want some? You want some I'll give it yas

Post self-deleted by Kanatistan.

Pevvania wrote:I like this guy! Welcome back, Actum.

Thanks, glad to be back.

Kanatistan wrote:Yeah... But I don't seem to well... Stick.

Nor do I.

Kanatistan wrote:Yeah... But I don't seem to well... Stick.

The State Of Deseret wrote:Nor do I.

What do you mean? Your dogged perseverance in carving a niche for yourself within Libertatem is one of the greatest displays of individualism I've seen. And you know how much I support the rights and responsibilities of the individual!

Would anyone be willing to endorse me?

Post self-deleted by Kanatistan.

But tbh Transhuamnist Anarchism to me seems the most reasonable.

The State Of Deseret wrote: Why?

Because you just said you don't change as much as people say, and then you changed.

Assembled with Dot's Region Saver.
Written by Refuge Isle.