Post Archive
Region: The Mystical Council
"64 minutes ago: The Colony of Oakplumington renamed the office held by The Armed Revolutionaries of Tumetu-iin Noyan from "Lunar Council Member" to "Lunar Councillor (Stepping Down)" in The Mystical Council."
Is that necessary?
He also appointed parakka, it think it is so people know parakka is replacing me, but my term was not in complete when he made the change.
Yeah, while Parakka does have my vote, when a Lunar Councillor announces that they plan to resign after end of term, whomever they support does not just take their seat right away. LCM seats are not by appointment Oak, you know this. Parakka has to be voted in.
Parakka Northland
He is the only canidate though.
Parakka Northland
Sorry for the confusion, Chef.
Yes, Noyan and Plugo are right. Parakka has won the election by default. However, since Noyan's term doesn't end technically until the full moon on the eighteenth, we sort of have this weird transition period. This doesn't happen like this very often with the Lunar Council elections. But yeah. That's the reason why.
Actually if they want to, Noyan and Parakka can mutually agree to just complete the switch early if they want to. I'd be cool with that.
Barishmacht, Parakka Northland
I believe that my national flag is the pinnacle of culture.
Forestavia
Im happy with whatever works best :)
Oakplumington
I was reading the Constitution. It seemed that the sentagin is an autonomous body. While the lunar council is like the executive body like the cabinet in other regions which discharge all the powers. Am I correct?
Forestavia, Exotic Lemon
As much as I like [nation=short]parakka Northland[/nation] and [nation=short]Naumadal[/nation] I dont think it is fair that because they run unopposed. I encourage other nations to run as well.
Barishmacht
Well, there's not too much we can do about lack of interest. Man, I remember the old days when there were 3 or 4 nations here. We would get raided by Nugut and we would grant the raiders immediate spots on the Council because we didn't have enough nations in the region to fill all the government positions. And then they would leave because it was just a tag raid and most weren't interested in staying. And we would be sad and lonely again until the next raid. Ah, the memories...
Parakka Northland
Almost. You are right about Sentagon being autonomous. Time for a quick civics lesson.
So basically, we have three branches of government. The Delegate (like the executive branch), The Lunar Council, (the legislative and judicial branch with some executive ability), and Sentagon, which is an autonomous legislative branch open to everyone else (contact the Sentagon President to register today!). You can think of Sentagon as being like the US House of Representatives with its own house rules or you can think of it as being the branch consisting of the voters. Not every resident will be an active voter but the active voters are usually members of Sentagon. Sentagon is supposed to be everyone else basically - at least everyone who is active in our community.
The cabinet is a separate thing and consists of the Map Minister (Permanently New Bacon under Regional Law), the ORCA Rep (Appointed by the Delegate from a list of names provided by the Lunar Council and the President of Sentagon), and Secretary Delegate (Appointed by the Delegate).
Now here's the political theory. WA nations elect the Delegate with their endorsements. The Delegate is basically the representative of the WA nations.
Every full moon, a Lunar Council seat is up for reelection. Every Lunar Councillor serves for five moons. The residents democratically elect the Lunar Council Members. Every vote is equal in this election.
Within the branch of government called "Sentagon", WA members get 2 votes and non-WA members get 1 vote.
[spoiler=Usually this is the part where someone says, "Hold on, that isn't really fair is it?"] It totally is fair, believe me and this system really does work.
1. Every individual player retains control over their own nation and decides whether it is worth it or not to them to keep WA on their nation. The choice is yours to make.
2. It prevents the region from turning into a raging war machine.
3. It motivates nations to keep their WA status here which keeps the region active and stable.
4. It keeps the powers of an executive Delegate in check because WA nations are free to elect the Delegate anytime they want to.
5. Sentagon remains on equal footing with the other two branches.
[/spoiler]
The Sentagon Policies are still under construction and being debated and drafted. There is still a lot of work that Sentagon has to do on itself. I encourage you to join Sentagon and participate in the discussions. There is another region dedicated just to Sentagon in case we need it. All members of Sentagon are expected to be active and to participate in polls. We used to automatically enroll everyone in Sentagon who wasn't the Delegate or a Lunar Councillor but that created a ton of bureaucratic chaos so we fixed that. It also appears that Sentagon's internal government structure is going to be changing very soon. These are exciting times. Sentagon is still in it's early stages of development.
Parakka Northland
[nation=short]Rondaland[/nation] if [nation=short]Plugo[/nation] replaces you then will you run for his LC seat?
I have added this to the historical record.
The Lunar Council under the Sturgeon Moon 2016
Lunar Council President: [nation=short]AU912 Mystical Council Consulate[/nation]
Lunar Councillor: [nation=short]Rrepaimziaraseh[/nation]
Lunar Councillor: [nation=short]Plugo[/nation]
Lunar Councillor: [nation=short]Exotic Lemon[/nation]
Lunar Councillor: [nation=short]Parakka Northland[/nation]
Notes: [nation=short]Tumetu-iin Noyan[/nation] decided not to run to keep their spot on the Lunar Council. [nation=short]Parakka Northland[/nation] ran for the Lunar Council unopposed and therefore won the election by default.
[nation=short]Plugo[/nation] challenged [nation=short]Rondaland[/nation] to hold an election for President of Sentagon. [nation=short]Rondaland[/nation] began the election process for the President of Sentagon.
Tumetu-Iin Noyan, Parakka Northland
Oh, I am sorry, I was not aware of that.
No problem. I have to admit it looked kind of shady the way I did it in the middle of the night without any explanation. I figured I was awake and it was the 14th and the elections should be starting but there is no election to start since there's no one else.
Talk about a change from last month, huh? We went from an exciting five-way race where Exotic Lemon won as a write-in candidate to this month with a default win. It's probably the August lull.
Au912 Mystical Council Consulate, Parakka Northland, Exotic Lemon
Regarding the current poll, I recommend that each candidate would tell us more about their platform on the RMB (Even better if you make a detailed dispatch)
I.E: Why should we vote for you as President of Sentagon?
Au912 Mystical Council Consulate
Yes just do it now.
Why communism will always fail: "A claim for equality of material position can be met only by a government with totalitarian powers."
Forestavia, Plugo, Parakka Northland
Oh my, ok um... Rondaland. Buddy, we've got to talk about this poll. There are a "few" problems with it.
#1 - 24 hours is too short for an election this important. We should lengthen the poll so that it is at least 3 days long. That way all of Sentagon has a chance to vote.
#2 - The poll should clearly state that it is open to members of Sentagon only. It is illegal for the Delegate and Lunar Councillors to vote in this election as they are outside of the branch. This is a violation of[spoiler=Section 6]6. The Delegate, The Lunar Council, and Sentagon shall make up the three branches of government. Two branches must approve of regional legislation and treaties in order to go into effect. These three branches must remain separate and distinct from one another. A member of one branch cannot vote in another branch.[/spoiler]of the Constitution.
Yes even Plugo - Even though Plugo is a candidate Plugo is not part of Sentagon and cannot vote even for himself. The only reason why it is even permitted for Plugo to run for this office is because he has pledged to resign in the event that he wins.
Alternatively, if Plugo resigns from the Lunar Council prior to the Sentagon election that wouldn't be a problem at all. Plugo could vote for himself then.
To refer to another example, the Secretary Delegate has to be very careful about section 6 as well. The Secretary Delegate is a member of Sentagon but if they are acting in place of the Delegate then they cannot obviously vote as a member of Sentagon too because this blurs the lines between the branches of government too much.
#3 - As a WA member of Sentagon, I have two votes and I intend to split my vote casting one vote for Plugo and one for Rondaland. But there is no third option in the poll that allows this. There should at least be an "Other - Specify on RMB" option. This will allow write-ins and vote splitting members of Sentagon to be accommodated.
I really hope these three points make sense to everyone.
Au912 Mystical Council Consulate, Plugo, Parakka Northland
Their is no official rule about poll time or a third option to split is their?
Forestavia
Sentagon is another branch of government. I don't see the reason of that rule. Plus anybody should be able to vote in a Sentagon president election just like the lunar councilors can be elected by anyone. Just restricting the votes to Sentagon is unreasonable if you ask me.
Plugo, Exotic Lemon
#2 the constitution is not official as of yet. There better be some changes to section 6 of the constitution. Anybody should be able to vote for Sentagon president just like anybody can vote for lunar council members. That's infringing the voting rights of lunar councilors and delegates. I don't want any excuses as to why it shouldn't be changed.
Plugo, Exotic Lemon
That outlined in bold has to be changed I'll let it slide this time. Anybody should vote for the Sentagon president. That outlined in bold I have a problem with.
[nation=short]plugo[/nation] should be able to vote for himself too. Like I said that crap needs to be changed [nation=short]forestavia[/nation].
Plugo
Yeah, sentagon gets to vote on everything but the lunar council/delegate don't always vote. Why bother electing us if you don't want our votes? I am not trying to disrespect anyone but this is confusing to me.
New Bacon, Plugo
Post self-deleted by New Bacon.
Yes they do. And there is a reason for this advantage: to keep the people in control of their government and not the other way around.
Do you realize that this region has so much freedom that four votes could turn this region into an authoritarian dictatorship over night? Your vote as Delegate and 3 votes (a simple majority) from the Lunar Council could pass the most outrageous law and it would have passed two branches - the Delegacy and the Lunar Council.
So what prevents this from happening? It should be so easy to pass a regional law that curbs rights and freedoms if it only takes four votes from the Delegacy and the Lunar Council. But why doesn't this happen?
The purpose for giving Sentagon the advantage in nearly everything is to keep the power in the hands of the people.
Sentagon is autonomous.
The Lunar Council and Delegacy are not.
The Lunar Council holds enough power over the region already, both as individuals and even more power as a collective body. They were already elected by the residents in a democratic way.
The Delegate also has access to huge amounts of power having the executive designation. You, New Bacon, were already elected via endorsements the WA nations, many of whom reside in Sentagon.
Sentagon is the rest of us. The ones who are not elected to government. And to ensure an equitable distribution of political power in this region, the President of Sentagon is to be elected from among and by the members of Sentagon and not by the other members of government who we have already put into office. We have already entrusted the Delegate and Lunar Councillors with powers and responsibilities so that they can serve our region - so that they can serve us.
By excluding these members of government from our own Presidential election, we have insured that our voices cannot be silenced by the other two branches. And our voices are stronger this way. It is not the government's place to tell the people how to run their own government. Nor is it right for the other two branches to involve themselves in this internal Sentagon proceeding called the "Sentagon Presidential election".
Au912 Mystical Council Consulate, Plugo, Parakka Northland
*Throws a rock at oak*
That's an excuse. Everybody should have a voice regardless whether they are in government or not. Section6 needs to be changed before constitutional vote takes place again. That's my opinion on it.
There is absolutely no excuse that the lunar councilors or the delegate shouldn't vote for sentagon president. There is absolutely no excuse that [nation=short]plugo[/nation] should not vote for himself. [nation=short]forestavia[/nation] that should be resolved. And it shouldn't be based on what you want, it should be based on our voices. We don't care what Sentagon does but we should be able to vote for the president.
There is no official rule about poll time, but I feel that it is in good taste to give Sentagon a fair chance to participate in the election of their own President.
There is technically no official rule about a third option to split, however, it follows directly from the fact that WA members have two votes within Sentagon that there is an option to split. This is because they are free to exercise their right to cast their votes as they choose.
Good questions.
Post self-deleted by New Bacon.
Post by Forestavia suppressed by New Bacon.
It's an internal proceeding. Would you take kindly to the Lunar Council telling you that you had to veto or approve a law against your wishes?
What if Sentagon decided to tell you who to appoint as Secretary Delegate? That wouldn't be fair would it?
To allow you and the other Councillors to vote in it would be a form of government overreach on the part of the Delegate and Lunar Council. That is too much power in the hands of the Delegate and Council. Sentagon needs it's fair share of the power too.
Plugo, Parakka Northland
The President of the Sentagon is precisely that: President of the Sentagon. The President of the Sentagon is not the President of the Lunar Council. The U.S. Senate does not vote in the election of the Speaker of the House. That is the House of Representatives' business. This is no different.
Forestavia, Plugo, Parakka Northland
Post self-deleted by New Bacon.
Post self-deleted by New Bacon.
Post by Forestavia suppressed by New Bacon.
*catches rock*
Everybody does have a voice - and they have a stronger voice than they would have in a direct democracy. Our region is not a direct democracy and it never will be. Direct democracy is nothing more and tyranny by majority rule.
So over the past two years, we have carefully created various kinds of representative democracy with various checks on government power while working in harmony with the mechanics of the game. Sentagon needs a lot of work. I know that for sure. But the basic premise of self-rule will be protected. Sentagon needs these protections.
That has nothing to do with voting dummy. It's like the bicameral government. AU912 is right about that. The senate can't vote for the house speaker. Get your concepts straight. And aren't you role playing the USA dummy?
Yes I am. I can see AU912 and your point. But...
Plugo
Post self-deleted by New Bacon.
I feel sentagin should be treated as a separate autonomous region. The region will have representation in the mystical council. But they will be deciding their own future
New Bacon, Plugo, Naumadal
Alright I guess I need to stop talking.
That would be an absolute last resort. There is a process by which Sentagon can separate from the main region but.....
*crosses fingers*
Hopefully it doesn't come to that.
Parakka Northland
We covered a lot of ground tonight. We should all sleep on what we've discussed and think about things some more over the next few days. This is an important conversation that needed to happen. Where we go from here will effect the future of this region for months possibly years ahead.
Parakka Northland
That absolutely ridiculous. Sentagon is TMC and TMC is Sentagon, to speak of one while ignoring the other is nonsense. If a bunch of people in the region want to pack up their bags and leave to make their own new region, that's their own business. However, the idea of us chopping off one of our own limb and handing it to them on the way out, that's just out of the question.
Forestavia, Parakka Northland
Well I am sorry I just gave my opinion. I certainly don't want sentagin to be independent. I was talking it being a dependency on our region. But I don't want any break-off.
Plugo, Parakka Northland
1. You are absolutely entitled to state whatever opinion you want, no matter how bad it is. I am sorry if I made you feel otherwise.
2. Of course Sentagon is dependent on the rest of the region, and the region is dependent on it. That is how things should be and it is a good thing. Again, back to the limbs analogy; your legs are dependant on the rest of your body just as much the rest of your body is dependent on them.
Barishmacht, Parakka Northland
Agreed. I did not feel bad
Barishmacht, Parakka Northland
Wow 32 messages to wake up too.... Well after reading them all, I can see both sides of the argument, and I think it's a difficult issue. However, I would say that I in general I agree with [nation=short]Forestavia[/nation], with one difference and that being I think [nation=short]plugo[/nation] should be allowed to take part in the vote. Simply because he is a candidate, though weather that means he should resign from the Lunar Council first is a matter for debate. As there is an argument to be made that if one person wants to swap government positions weather from LC to Sentagon or whatever, they should probably resign their current role first, as otherwise it could look like they a hedging their bets.
Just my initial thoughts on the subject
Plugo
I think it's alright that Plugo holds his LC office during the vote. In the end what matters is that he can't hold both offices. So he should stay in the LC for now, but when the poll ends, if he wins, he will be immediately dropped from his LC seat and reinstated in the new office.
Plugo
Since i cannot vote I wish to endorse [nation=short]plugo[/nation]. [nation=short]rondaland[/nation] there is nothing wrong with you, but I do want to see a new president. This region needs change.
Plugo
I said i was ready to be dismissed as councilor a day or two ago, so i am voting in the poll on the basis that i requested to be dismissed already.
Parakka Northland
hi
Exotic Lemon
hi
Exotic Lemon
Mighty fine region
Forestavia
Post by Everloyal4 suppressed by New Bacon.
How do I get involved?
Have you come to appeal your banishment before the Lunar Council?
Parakka Northland
Hello! Welcome!
I will complete the switch then. Noyan you are officially a member of Sentagon. Parakka, you are officially a member of the Lunar Council.
Plugo, Parakka Northland
- NS News Update -
Heroes Rise has been attacked today. They are also a member of ORCA. Defenders interested in helping should reach out to Orca Hq.
I had trouble fitting all of the new information on the WFE. I had to delete some stuff. If someone has time today feel free to dress it up a little.
Plugo
Feeling patriotic today so decided on a flag chance :)
Forestavia
Flag looks good, are you british?
Parakka Northland
Y'all may need to separate yourselves and do business in [region=Sentagon] those that are not Sentagon members can stay here.
Plugo, Rondaland
I think the president and or sentagon council COULD reside their if needed, at least for polls.
New Bacon, Exotic Lemon, Rondaland
Okay you won goodluck as president.
New Bacon, Plugo, Parakka Northland
Yep :)
Forestavia, New Bacon, Plugo, Exotic Lemon
Wait why was the poll a day? And why did you leave?
Forestavia, New Bacon, Plugo, Parakka Northland
How come you left?
New Bacon, Plugo
[nation=short]oakplumington[/nation] dismiss everyone that has a position here and make me president.
By appealing your ban to the Lunar Council. That is the only way for you to get involved at this point.
You have 48 hours to formally appeal your case. Otherwise I will have no choice but to ban you again. I'd hate to do it, honestly. I voted against the banjection. You are a former delegate after all and I believe you contributed a lot to the region.
You should try to provide a convincing appeal and they may reduce the sentence. Maybe you would be able to return to the region again.
Naumadal
Ok.
Naumadal
I did not like the way that poll was conducted at all. Next time we have an election for President of Sentagon, I will be conducting the poll.
Parakka Northland, Exotic Lemon, Naumadal
Just on the off chance, that I missed everyone statement as to why they should be president of Sentagon..... so if you don't mind can you ask what your plan is for you're presidency
Naumadal
My main goal is to establish the sentagon council, and that will be the first thing i do.
Oakplumington, Parakka Northland
i will establish poll rules for sentagon.
Oakplumington, Parakka Northland
If you would like any help let me know and I'll happy give you a hand providing you don't mind of course
Exotic Lemon
Mystical Council, Fellow ORCAn region, Heroes Rise, has been raided and we need your help. Which of your WA nations are to join the ORCA Military?
Forestavia
New bacon and I each own a small private military.
Forestavia
[nation=short]Naumadal[/nation],
If I don't hear anything from anyone else by tonight, either New Bacon or I will give you the spot on the Lunar Council. It looks like you might just win the special election by default.
I want to give everyone about six more hours to think about it since there have been so many changes in our government recently.
Plus that would also allow for different time zones
Forestavia, Au912 Mystical Council Consulate
The Delegate over in Heroes Rise has....
[spoiler=17 endorsements!]Endorsements Received: 17 » Fob Int Engunofnvats, Rava West, Roeekania, Vity Timzalderklavil, Victoria Tarisa, Aurum Dol, Super Unicorn Space Fleet, Cheeril-E, Easia Laucting, Yuno23, Pracinha Hawk, DEN Puppet, Bodhisattva Anointed by Dark Water, The Wise Badger, Reimia, Magnificent Otterman, and Emperius. [/spoiler]
Every little bit that we can contribute to this ORCA mission will help.
Au912 Mystical Council Consulate, Parakka Northland
What I'm asking is who are the WA nations in this region willing to be a part of the ORCA Military and go over to Heroes Rise and liberate them.
I have 4-5 bacon has like 3 or 4
Au912 Mystical Council Consulate
I'll be over. We've gotta chase those birds out of there!
i could come, who do i endorse?
Hey [nation=short]Everloyal[/nation], you want to help us out with this ORCA mission? It will probably help you out when the time comes for you to stand before the Lunar Council. Just saying, opportunities like this don't land in your lap too often. We'll be going in when Bacon/Lemon give us the word. You should join us.
Plugo
Lol! Just got a recruitment telegram to joint The Black Hawks. Oh, the irony....
Plugo
*Join
Au912 Mystical Council Consulate, Plugo
I can bring the guard and maybe chef. It might take some time to get organized though
Forestavia, New Bacon
[nation=short]Moltavo[/nation], [nation=short]Asteroid Colony GJ-042[/nation], and [nation=short]Mugwop[/nation] please return with your was.
New Bacon, Plugo
I will be undoing the recent changes to the factbook in the next day unless someone else makes an adequate fix. Right now the factbook looks horrible. It makes it sound like we're an offshoot colony of ORCA, with no sense of individuality of independence of our own.
Not to say I don't support ORCA, I will be helping them in their current mission, but the current WFE is just awful.
Forestavia, Plugo
Please fix it. You can delete whatever now. That was my doing and there just wasn't enough space for me to put everything I wanted to on it.
Done. I don't know what exactly was the WFE just few days ago, so I just used the one that Malcholm posted a while ago and made few edits.
Few things to note.
1. I haven't been keeping up, but I reposted this anyway, however, why was this message needed to begin with?
"* Should we redo the Sentagon Presidential Election Poll?"
2. Removed The Greater Holy Isles message until the situation arises that makes it necessary (give it few days)
3. Removed the post regarding [nation=short]Everloyal4[/nation]. Infact, [B]I encourage anyone with border control[/B] to ban his new puppet. If he wishes to appeal his case, he should do so from outside of our main region or any other region that falls under our direct territory.
Forestavia
[B]HERE IS THE WFE FOR FUTURE RECORD:[/B] (Quote this post to see the code properly)
[color=green]Welcome to The Mystical Council, a region that upholds the principles of freedom and democracy! [/color] [color=navy]There is one position on the Lunar Council up for reelection every full moon, that you may run for. We are a region with a focus on role play and regional government. You may also apply to join the Sentagon (one of our three branches of government) 48 hours after joinning the region.[/color]
[hr]
[color=red]⇃ ALERTS ⇂[/color] | [color=orange]Regional Info Center[/color]
* Heroes Rise has been invaded! Contact ORCA to help!
* Should we redo the Sentagon Presidential Election Poll? Discuss in RMB.
* [color=red]Check for new polls in [region=Sentagon] and Mystical Council![/color]
[hr]
The Mystical Council is a proud member of the Orca Hq alliance.
[hr][color=orange]Song of the Week: Eurythmics - Sweet Dreams[/color]
just put it in a factbook
i kind of agree, he should be in Mystical Council which is designated as the region for ban appeals.
Forestavia
Agreed. I'll give the three regional heads a chance to do it. If no one else does it in about two days, then I'll do it.
Done sir.
[nation=short]everloyal[/nation], [nation=short]everloyal2[/nation], [nation=short]everloyal3[/nation], [nation=short]everloyal4[/nation], [nation=short]everloyal6[/nation] please move your puppets to [region=mystical council] for ban appeals. Thank you sir.
Assembled with Dot's Region Saver.
Written by Refuge Isle.