Post Archive
Region: The Mystical Council
This is an emergency - and I just did
http://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=690746
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Parakka Northland
No its not.
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Exotic Lemon
You can't just claim something to be a emergency just to past legislation through that no one wants to be passed right now.
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Civilisunio, Exotic Lemon
This isn't an emergency though we are perfectly fine
Plugo
Why are you opposed to a 3 day minimum?
I am not, but we can VOTE on it after the elections for the ministry have commenced.
We don't need to stretch the first elections for 2-3 weeks.
Once all the positions have been voted for we can sign the 3 day into law, but for these first elections 2 days is acceptable
We need a government now. I promised I would bring back democracy but that won't happen if we keep delaying the poll
Plugo
Any time the government begins to slide down the dangerous road of not being held accountable to the people, I will act. This decree is simply a reminder of that.
Parakka Northland
If we ask all our our people you are the minority
A government should also protect the minority. Please extend the future polls by one day.
Parakka Northland
We need democracy back now, I will not go back on my word to bring democracy back
Plugo, Parakka Northland
Democracy is a common goal that you and I share. Let's build one together.
New Bacon, Parakka Northland
So what it ozone day off? We will perform 3 day polls from now on.chalk it up as a mistake and move on. Don't use emergency powers and delay
Plugo
I'm not delaying anything. I have upheld our democratic way of life with a single stroke of my pen. You want democracy? Then give my subjects a reasonable length of time to vote.
New Bacon, Parakka Northland
I have no desire to go back on my word but it delays us
For me it is an issue of hypocrisy. You say you want democracy but then my government shortens the poll length to two days giving fewer nations a chance to have a voice in this new government. That's my bottom line.
New Bacon, Republic Of Greater Cuba, Civilisunio, Parakka Northland
Call me a hypocrite all you want, it doesn't change the fact that we thought 2 days was fine. No one objected until you. If people object I will change it. But if you just push through legislation without approval it is no better than plugo making the poll 2 days
New Bacon, Civilisunio
Post self-deleted by New Bacon.
[nation=short]plugo[/nation] and [nation=short]exotic lemon[/nation] do non-wa votes count?
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Civilisunio
We are all b*tching about a time limit, this is truly sad, if someone did not vote on something, then so what? Welcome to life, stuff happens, and if someone says I'm wrong or says something like "We are trying to fix that situtation", guess what, you can't, we have lives outside of NS and extending polls means we actually have less in general
New Bacon, Exotic Lemon
The reason why I issued the decree was because some began to object and I agreed with them. I do not intend to make a habit of issuing decrees willy nilly. That would defeat the purpose of our democratic way of life. I have done this today to establish my proper role as the region's Monarch. I have given the people confidence that I will step in if necessary to prevent tyranny of any sort from taking root in here. This is something that must be done to also restore confidence among the nations after I complied with the revolutionary movement. Today's decree proves to my subjects that I will not stand by and watch liberty slip away via minor encroachments.
There will come a time in the future when someone will test me and try to put up a poll that violates my royal decree. I will stand firm.
New Bacon, Republic Of Greater Cuba, Parakka Northland, Exotic Lemon
You are a good monarch
New Bacon, Civilisunio, Parakka Northland, Exotic Lemon
Thank you.
I've got to go.
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Exotic Lemon
Yes they do
New Bacon, Republic Of Greater Cuba, Civilisunio
New Bacon
Can we not just change things without even informing people about it, i mean you and others were complaining the other day that people didn't read the dispatches, but if your constantly changing things then no wonder people cant keep up
I like Exotic Lemon but since this revolution i have said i would like to be delegate, and that hasn't changed
Wait you guys did when you dismissed the old Lunar Council without a vote :P
Wait i did earlier.... i think on page 431 somewhere
I think the problem is as delegate and thus the leader of this impromptu government you are the one responsible for its actions, as such and unfortunately for you, you cop the blame when something goes wrong or isnt done correctly. Im merely speculating with that one
By the way Plugo and Lemon im not hating on you both with my comments above, i actually quite like the both of you, just thought i would mention that so you dont think this is personal or anything
Civilisunio
Post self-deleted by Civilisunio.
I agree. I wanted to be delegate as Well. But i am running for minister of defense because i cant become delegate, see my defcon levels here:http://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=690612
Naumadal is the only one who dismissed the lc, not me or lemon.
[nation=short]Forestavia[/nation] says we need to protect the minority. What about the majority?
Most people here are tired of big beauracratic governments and the temporary government.
Having to set up a three 3day poll for 5 positions means that it will take over two weeks to get the elections through.
A 3 day poll is understandable for most polls, but the starter elections to fill all seats should be a special case.
Forestavia's ruling is tyrannical. Forcing legislation without consent of the region.
He say's is an 'emergency'. By this logic anything that affects the region that he doesn't agree with is an emergency and he will use his 'emergency' powers to force any laws he wants into the government without any checks or balances from government officers or the un-appointed tmc members.
If this law is forced through by forestavia i will probably be leaving the region, as i don't want to be in a region where the founder forces unwanted laws on the regional populace.
My campaign for minister is still on, and it is my duty to protect the opinions of the people, weather that be the majority, minority or one person.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
This decision is worse then the emergency government.
The old govt. may have been inefficient, but at least the people got a say it what laws and such where passed.
Exotic Lemon
Since clearly I am so tyrannical and hated why haven't you taken steps to remove me.
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Plugo
What have we changed that people weren't informed about?
We have had polls about every decision that lemon made?
1. Poll about whos running for positions
2. Poll about proposals, au912 's won
3. Making a poll for govt. positions since the MAJORITY of the region wants the elections to happen and end quicky.
Exotic Lemon
The second this poll ends I will put up one regarding keeping me staying delegate or if you guys want to replace me
There isn't a point.
Endorsements are free here, if people want you gone they will unendorse you.
If parakka wants to get the delegacy he should get people to endorse him, its that simple.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
No I resign the wa. Put it somewhere else for a while
Republic Of Greater Cuba
Why?
If the people wanted you gone they would un endorse you.
No point in resigning so someone who the people like less can take the seat
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Parakka Northland
What's happening?
I thought Au912 got his government put in?
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Plugo, Parakka Northland
Yeah, but everyone thinks that forest can't make polls shorter now or something like that
Lampar
I will stay for a while then sorry if this is making drama but this delegate position is very stressful
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Plugo
Why wouldn't he be able to?
There's no law about it.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
Forestavia can't force it upon nobody. I assure there will be a revolution (a serious one) if anything is forced upon.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
the founder is and has always had emergency powers.
he wants to force the poll times to be longer, so we will have two wait 15 days until the regional government is officially established.
this is not an emergency, the people want the government to be established now, not 15 days later just because the founder thinks that 48 hours isn't enough time for someone to check NS and vote.
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Lampar
Too long.
I don't care what he says, 48 hours is way too long for a nation to vote.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
i want the govt. to be established ASAP, if people dont check their nation during the poll time oh well, we have a government to make, we shouldn't have to wait for every bum to get off their butt to vote in the poll.
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Exotic Lemon
48 hours is reaspnably, he wants to make it 3-5 days
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Lampar
Excuse me.
That's extremely long.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
especially since most nations here besides [nation=short]mugwop[/nation] and [nation=short]forestavia[/nation] (mabye parakka too) don't want his thing to be passed, or want it to be delayed until the govt is elected.
Plugo
How does this constitute as an emergency?
Plugo, Civilisunio
Post by Republic Of Greater Cuba suppressed by Exotic Lemon.
I am sick f this "everyone has a voice and time" thing we have here, one day vote, thats it, screw anyone who didn't vote, because that is their problem and not ours
Lampar, Plugo
*of
I agree with rondaland, the whole region should not be delayed due to a few inactive nations, it's like sentagon before reforms all over again
we are just putting someone elses trouble into our hands
We need at least 2 in case of emergency or other reason, not everyone can check daily, but 5 days is pretty long
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Plugo
and boring, not waiting a week just for one thing to get passed
Plugo
I say most polls should be 2-3 days.
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Plugo
Its like the constiution all over again. a 14 day poll for a vote when all the nations that voted did so in the first 1-3 days.
yeah.
i can understand 3 days for NORMAL elections, but not for elections that come after a massive uprising.
if mugwop's 5 days thing happened, that would be over a month for the government to be established.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
2 days for special elections though (with prior notice), like if someone CTE's, Resigns mid term, or (like now) the construction of a new govt.
Exotic Lemon
-_-
In just one week since we have been arguing about this I have already gotten three medals, and even though I am comparing my gains to this situation, I feel it would be easier for us to just set a small voting time limit than it is earning three medals
Exotic Lemon
basically I am saying we need to fix this now
This is going to sound rude and blunt, but nobody cares about your medals. The reason I say that is because you think to much of yourself, not everyone on NSis exactly like you. If everyone agreed with you this region would be quite boring. Let thier be different opinions and ideas
Republic Of Greater Cuba
I have earned a newfound respect for you
The Lamparian government is effectively protesting the Mystical Council government.
Plugo
Thanks... I guess
You have the ability to talk back to me, no one has ever done that here
Exotic Lemon
the proletariat's wishses for elections don't fit with the bourgeoisie's wishes to extend the voting time hoping their followers will vote for their candidate.
if i was bourgeoisie i might want the same thing, the other canidate may have more votes then me, but if we have a 5 day poll i can contact everyone in the region that doesn't check their nations to vote for me
Lampar, Exotic Lemon
In protest of the recent actions of the government, I am making a region that is fully committed to protesting the Council's government.
Plugo
I am tired of trying to be an under the radar, layed back delegate. I am constantly being asked to do stuff and I am trying not be seen as a tyrant. But it is time for me to show some stronger leadership, unless you would prefer me like I was
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Lampar, Plugo
Be a ass all you like, shows you can fight back and I like people like that, shows they can stand up for themselves
we already made one just in case af ew days ago
Lampar
Never thought I would be pleased to be called that
Republic Of Greater Cuba
TG me.
Anyone that is in protest of the government join now!
*Peter jefferson participates in the revolt, firebombs the capital of forestavia https://www.washingtonpost.com/video/national/greek-protests-get-violent-with-tear-gas-molotov-cocktails/2015/11/12/3843b3c4-894b-11e5-bd91-d385b244482f_video.html*
Welcome to my life
Plugo, Exotic Lemon
I am going to ask you suspend the revolution for a few days. I think I can fix at least some of the problems
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Lampar
Accepted.
We need to sort this out now.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
Forestavia refuses to allow the removal of the k reich embassy, which the majority of the people agreed should be removed.
Now he forces us to wait longer for a regional government, which was one of the main reasons the original revolt happened.
Lampar
*riots begin*
One of the main prerequisites for democracy is periodical elections, and each election in a democracy is a time when the continuity of rule of law is put in jeopardy, especially when the former opposition party becomes the new governing party and vice-versa, because the ministries and government agencies have to switch their policies and because partisan hiring is commonplace. When the results of the election are very close, there is a chance of anarchy whilst the votes are recounted. After the 2006 Mexican presidential election, popular unrest with the tight results led to mass protests, asking for a recount, and the president-elect had to deal with a strong faction in the parliament that refused to recognize him, and with the contender refused to admit defeat.
On the other hand, monarchies are the most stable form of government due to no dilution of power and because the opposition has no real chance to become government, a consequence of this is that they avoid electoral turmoil almost altogether.
I wouldn't even matter if forestavia did become tyrannical, he is the founder and has the right to do so, HOWEVER, he prides himself on letting TMC self manage, but when **** hits the fan, his will cripples.
Republic Of Greater Cuba, Lampar
We are fixing the problem though, can't be fixed when the stages of fixing it are over turned
Republic Of Greater Cuba
We need the districts.
*sighs*
why?
Lampar
Au912 was the elected government type, and he and I came up with that district idea.
As the first and second place contenders, I think our idea should be put into place.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
districts?
Lampar
Au912 and I came up with idea of having districts.
Each district representative would be recognized in his House of Lords.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
it wasn't in his proposal that was voted for.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
What are the districts tho? Regions?
you still haven't said why its needed.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
No.
They're like factions inside of TMC.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
Those are called political parties, you mean forming some coalition?
Plugo
It was the thing that seemed the most likable.
Since Au912 and I were the 2 that had the most votes, we both think we should have a joint government.
You ever read the Hunger Games?
Joint governments lead to collapse, look at the eastern and western roman empire
Yeah, those districts are regions
Lampar
Then yes.
I thought you meant separate regions in the game.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
Let's time out before we make any hasty government systems. Haste = waste. If implement it now in desperation and then discover it doesn't work, then we go in a massive frustrating circle
Republic Of Greater Cuba
you should have put it in your factbook when they where voted on then, not try to slide it in an edit after the votes where counted.
you also still haven't said why its needed, which i have asked 3 times.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
Now that order has been restored, heres what I think
[nation=short]lampar[/nation], please hold off on the revolution. We had one less than a week ago, you have note even given us enough time to think up ideas to fix the government, let alone fix it. [nation=short]Plugo[/nation], you have been a massive help updating factbooks and such, please continue to that. [nation=short]republic of greater cuba[/nation], you are trying to rush change. Let it take place in its own time. I will take a more active role in this region though.
Republic Of Greater Cuba
Would it be okay if I dismiss the temporary government?
Civilisunio
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