Post Archive
Region: The Mystical Council
The vote was 5 - 4. Option 3 won. Noyan's vote did not count.
Parakka Northland
It was Tumetu-Iin Noyan to my understanding.
Also my WA is located here for the time being
I think we should keep the current election poll going. We should keep the winner on as the Foreign Affairs minister under the improved system. It would save poll time.
I would be happy to set up the next poll. We'll telegram each other to make sure we are on the same page.
Parakka Northland
Yes I will verify Alistia. I also verified forest a while back, in case that still matters.
Malcholm, Terran Flux
thats fine but just put it in the motto. I think before we start re hauling the whole election system, we need to make sure citizenship is updated. After that, we will start working on elections.
Terran Flux
If youre gonns gut and ruin the goveremt, do it right.
In the 3 years ive been in tmc, we only had one good foreigj affairsofficer.
Kamukaze.
He is gone now, and if we are cutting postions, that needs to go.
The officers that have held the position in the year of time that its existes havent done jack besides one. Besides, 1 person maintainin all our embassies and relations is too much to handle.
I am gonna make a dispatch on an ambassador proposal for 1 naion to represent relations with one or a few regions that they are close with.
(Ex: i would do libertatem, ussd, galactic empire, the roman empire)
But i am obligated to state that this system wasnt built or made to sustain the region with just 3 ministers (1 of which is useless)
Merging da and ca is bad because one who is good and loves the current roles may not be good, or want to handle both.
Ex: mugwop is the best domestic affairs guy weve ever had, but he probably isnt interested in doing the news or regional activites.
This could lead to a shortage of candidates who dont want to handle the merged roles.
I also would rather have the old lc back (under a different name like the imperial senate, and changed a bit structure/power wise)
Then seeing my precious baby (govt system) being changed in a way that wont help any of our current problems. (And will make some worse)
Exotic Lemon
Oh, I can certainly do ambassadorial thingy ma bobs.
Gyuamno, Alistia, Malcholm
So you would be in favour of option 2
I think it's alright to merge Domestic and Culture. Thanks for the shoutout by the way.
As to the duties of the culture minister, there has been several people here who have expressed interest in making news, so that's already taken care of. For regional activities, I can do some stuff. The only one remaining is RP, but I feel most people here who are intrested in RP do it in Solar Alliance.
Forestavia, Alistia
You as well, Viva >.> I gave you warning like a week and a half ago.
Looking into it in a bit, but I can tell you now for sure that Viva & Tumetu were not verified, pusing the results even further in favor of Opt. 3.
Alistia, Parakka
Would maybe be wise to use that to dump embassies that none of us have any relations with.
[I](☞゚ヮ゚)☞ my man! But that's playing right into the hands of our golrious leader![/I]Alistia
What a mess, I stayed up until 6:30 AM!
Time, however, was well spent!
Alistia, Malcholm, Terran Flux
I see my puppet was mentioned. I don't want to complain to anyone. I CAN post news but I have to mention some of the following conditions.
A) My name is in my puppet, Bacon Central News. It's obvious that I own the puppet because of "bacon" in the name.
B) I can post news, but I also have a life. If I don't, then that means I have bigger priorities listed before nationstates. Mugwop's condition is good but also mugwop does not make all the decisions for the region by himself. Don't bandwagon Forestavia.
C) Bacon Central Newsis a primary New Bacon News Puppet which will mention mostly politics in New Bacon, but I can mention politics with the region as well. The puppet is not considered a government ran puppet and is a private puppet in the private sector of my country.
D) It doesn't hurt to post news once a month, but don't criticize the short length if the news content is short. It could be due to me being busy.
F) In accordance to the basic rights of nations, I can see why Forestavia appointed the news puppets. There is freedom of the press. And any news puppet can request appearance powers at any given time if they have a puppet dedicated to news.
That's all I got.
Forestavia, Parakka Northland
Pls Bacon put your name in your motto. Same with Tmc Weekly News and The Mystical Council News Agency. Just help me sleep at night.
Pretty pls
New Bacon
Why the hell am I not verified?My wa is Gagala.
Forestavia, Alistia, New Bacon, Malcholm, Terran Flux
I also want to point out to our dearest fckboi friend Forestavia, that when he let Oakplumington CTE the first time, there was at least one outsider group that planned to invade and refound the region.
The even casually created the nation Tmc Refounder, a week after Oak CTE, just to prepare for the occasion.
The more you know.
Alistia, New Bacon, Malcholm
I need sleep too, I don't get enough rest with everyday work, in conjunction to nationstates. Forestavia just about drained all my energy when patrolling the region at update to keep it from being destroyed. I need help sleeping too. I will think about it.
Alistia
Didn't have info on an alt, wasn't sure where to look. Fixed.
Alistia
That noted, the official vote on the last poll remains a tie, with 4 votes for both option two and three instead of 5 for three and 4 for two. There's no rule on this, but I've been giving nations one week past their WA resignation to re-apply or get verified before dropping their citizenship status--this is why Forestavia's and VIVA's votes both still count, not to mention the fact that they were technically already verified anyway by the conclusion of the poll. Gyuamno had resigned from the WA before the conclusion of the poll, and has thus far failed to re-apply or provide myself or Lemon a valid WA nation/ request verification, claiming "secession from TMC!" I don't want to count their vote if they aren't going to comply, but if we were to count it the final tally would bounce back to 5-4, opt. 3 being the winner.
FINAL TALLY - 0, 4, 4, 0
It seems we either need a second attempt, or a new poll with some of the ideas suggested by other members of the region. I think it would be better to iron out some of the quirks we have with the existing system before scrapping it yet again, but Alistia'sideas have some merit. The Lunar Council was a functional system of governance, albeit a bit tyrannical. The solution there is to hold members to higher standards and have a method of regularly auditing the LC. i don't like term limits because they impede people who are actually successful in their elected positions.
Alistia, Exotic Lemon
You might have missed this in your assessment
I would say that if a poll closes and nation's have voted but not been verified then tough as effectively it delays the official result by up to a week. Also Forestavia was verified by me during the poll and I believe you yourself said you knew where his WA was during the discussion but I could be wrong.
Baring term lengths as I don't agree that people could be able to remain in office indefinitely, most of that would fall under my suggestion of option 2
I already factored in Tumetu's vote not counting, the result remains the same.
I wouldn't like having to wait a week, people could use that as a filibuster and we really don't need that. I think 3 days is a fair amount of time to fair. You're correct in saying that Forestavia is verified, but incorrect in saying you contributed to that verification 😛 it's all well and dandy, but the only two who have that permission are myself and Lemon--which, again, should be expanded to the PM in the event Oak CTE's again.
Set terms are fine, I just don't like having a maximum number of terms a person can serve. If they're still effective in their position and the region is alright with their continued service, why should they have to go?Alistia, Parakka Northland
Oh I agree that people no matter how many times have been apart of government should be allowed to serve if they wish and if elected.
Fair enough in terms of forest verification :)
I believe that the deciding vote under current rules / system goes to Oakplumington as he is Emperor of the region, on wether Option 2 or 3 wins the vote.
Alistia
I will not bend to you tyrants! SECESSION IS THE ANSWER, GYUAMNO WILL RISE AGAIN!
Malcholm, Terran Flux
We are losing WA nations fast. I do not want to constantly reverify people who move their wa, so I will go ahead and approve a few people.
Viva Italia has my verification, as well as Gyuamno and Alistia
Gyuamno, Alistia, Malcholm
I move my WA around alot, too
But I am starting to keep it on Elysium when I'm not participating in a R/D org.
Alistia, Malcholm
You also have my verification
Alistia, Malcholm
If you or anyone else can find an old factbook on them it would be a big help.
Id say option 2 and 3 each get factbook(s) written as an official proposal(s) for a clear cut system. (Since its obvious were doing a change)
We have a lot of news puppets, but news hasnt been madr in a while. Having an official weekly newd article made will ensure there is always one even when the independant stations dont pump out an article.
No one is impeding on their freedoms.
And the news puppets dont and shouldnt be appointed nations.
Malcholm, Terran Flux
Given that absolutely no one ran for the postion of Minister of Culture in the candidacy poll, we should just go with option 3. There is just not intrest in the position. So why keep something that no one is intrested in?
Malcholm
That just means culture minister is sometimes not needed, however sometimes it is. 4 votes clearly indicates some people are interested. So it doesnt automatically mean we go with the other option
Alistia
Well if you were intrested, you should have ran for the postion. But alright then, you who do not want to remove the minister of culture
Barishmacht, Terran Flux, Tumetu-Iin Noyan, Exotic Lemon, and Viva Italia
Which of you would take the position and uphold its responsibility?
You can't just expect the postion to be there with no one serving in it.
Parakka Northland
Does lemon verification change things in terms of the vote? As it's only 6 hours after your post
I don't want to mess up everything if it is already settled out. I will let you guys decide. Also just in case I forgot Parakka Northland you have my verification if you need it
Parakka Northland
Indeed. I think it should be merged with domestic or merged with another position. I have no desire for the position, and when I was culture minister I spend my days counting down until my term ended.
Malcholm, Terran Flux
Doesn't do you any good, if you are delegate. Oak will just log on and reappoint them.
I'm totally ok with the office powers, but there must be news content posted by those officials. If they are inactive, Exotic Lemon or Forestavia can dismiss them. Either way the News puppets can flood the RMB if they don't have office powers in which nothing can be done legally to stop them. Forestavia and Mugwop are in the right in this instance. It's the law!
Forestavia, Exotic Lemon
If I lose the current election I will happily return to my old position.
and continue to do nothing?
Agreed. The last time we had a MoC do something was before there was a designated MoC. In fact.. Lemon posting that poll about getting involved in another region's anniversary events is more than I've seen any recent MoC do. TBH, I think "Culture" as a responsibility is something that should befall the Delegate (technically, it already does), and not be delegated to a ministerial position. I don't see any real reason to keep the position.
No, he still requires mine or Oak's. Not to be difficult, but considering
I'm not verifying unless I see some WA.
Help me out here: https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=899799
Forestavia
I can handle culture again if you guys want
Malcholm
u aint getting diddly tuff guy
My boi Lemon absolved me and I dont need your corrupt verification practices of locating WA nations, WHERES FREEDOM OF MOVEMENT! TYRANNY WAKE UP SHEEPLE!
Malcholm
Easily the best part of my day.
Gyuamno
I can back this up as well. Viva's WA hasn't changed for many many months.
Gyuamno is pretty close with the bears from what I understand.
Alistia, Malcholm
This is my take on the culture thing. We are all equally responsible for regional culture! How can we expect to put the weight of an entire region's culture on a single minister's shoulders? We citizens shall all serve equally in the service of our glorious cultural heritage and we will share it in common in a great unified community! Yes, it is us who are the true heirs and creators of the TMC culture.
Gyuamno, Malcholm, Parakka Northland
We need to give the press access to basic powers during this time of transition. It gives them closer access to the government and will keep the government transparent to the people while we make repairs to the current government system.
I'll happy write a more detailed proposal when we know what's going on. As TBH I'm far to busy to be writing stuff just for the sake of it. So Forestavia can you make a decision on option 2 or 3 won the poll please to speed things along.
Alistia, Exotic Lemon
I was under the impression that option 3 had already won and that to formalize it we would put option 3 up for a Yea, Nay, Abstain vote. Does this sound reasonable?
[nation=short]Exotic Lemon[/nation],
if the foreign affairs candidates are still tied at the close of the poll you will be in charge of breaking the tie in accordance with Mugwop's election schedule dispatch.
Exotic Lemon
I'll be back on in a few hours to put up the next poll.
I would prefer to skip that if possible, and just move onto the post I made the other day regarding how we could shrink the government and wether to go for specific positions or a Council style system, as otherwise we are just going to extend the whole process. However, if the delegate and judicial president agree that we should put anouther poll asking if option 3 is truly the desire of the region then fair enough, majority rules I guess.
FYI Exotic Lemon and Malcholm
currently my wa is here https://www.nationstates.net/nation=im_sooo_tir3d
Also, add me as a laison to https://www.nationstates.net/region=the_galactic_order , https://www.nationstates.net/region=libertatem ,https://www.nationstates.net/region=the_roman_empire
In addition, i know The Immortal Elysium works a lot with Lily and The West Pacific.
I also know Terran Flux, Viva Italia and Exotic Lemon are involved in bunicken.
There is no law saying that all news outlets must be appointed!
Yall talk about shrinking down the govt, but yet advocate for 3 inactive puppets to be officers!
If we just have One active news puppet appointed as an officer, I would be willing to withdraw my support for culture.
Malcholm, Parakka Northland
If anyone can find any document relating to the powers, etc of the old LC PLEASE post it in reply to this comment.
Malcholm, Parakka Northland
Tomorrow i'm gonna make a poll to amend this: https://www.nationstates.net/nation=alistia/detail=factbook/id=899974
To add these regions to it: https://www.nationstates.net/nation=alistia/detail=factbook/id=899982
Forestavia, Malcholm
Ok. Viceroy Lemon? President Malcholm? Any objections to shrinking the government to three ministers?
Parakka Northland
While this is true that there is no law saying the news outlets should be appointed I like the idea of giving the press more access to the people. Let it be understood that these newspapers are NOT officers. Their function is strictly news. They have no bearing on the operation of our government. They are not ministers. They are not elected leaders. So basically we ARE shrinking the government not expanding it.
Gyuamno, New Bacon, Parakka Northland
While we wait for Lemon and Malcholm's input, I'm going to put up another poll to keep things moving.
Like this?
https://www.nationstates.net/nation=oakplumington/detail=factbook/id=442427
Parakka Northland
You don't seem to get it do you? I swear you all act like clowns sometimes. I know that Alistia!
Section 8 of the basic rights of nations: "Freedom of speech and of the press will be upheld with the exception being violation of NationStates website rules."
This is law! Given that ALSO there is no law restricting the number of news puppets appointed at or below 12 officers per nationstates rules. The puppets are free to post factbooks or RMB posts regarding news. Just being real.
Gyuamno, Alistia, Parakka Northland
*Puts on clown makeup*
Ok kids, are you ready to be entertained? ;)
Gyuamno, Alistia, New Bacon
Given that I also agree that there should be only one news puppet holding official powers. And not an unlimited number but there is no law saying that lemon and forest couldn't do it. Sorry Alistia.
Alistia, Oakplumington, Parakka Northland
Dang it! I can't vote in the poll because I'm not a resident.
Malcholm, Parakka Northland
This Halloween, we're going to learn that clowns aren't scary at all! :)
Some new vocabulary.
Lunar Council President/Judicial President will be renamed Chief Justice (to avoid confusion with the Delegate).
The "Viceroy (Delegate)" position will be renamed President/Delegate.
Malcholm, Parakka Northland
Who is on the Council? Illfated or Barishmacht?
I am sorry if I missed something, but did Forestavia just decide that he's gonna merge Foreign Affairs with Defense, even though the poll made it clear that we are dropping Culture (the postion that no one cared to run for)
What are you on about mate?
Alistia, Malcholm, Parakka Northland, Exotic Lemon
It is a close decision, but I will choose The Immortal Elysium. I choose him not to spite VIVA, but just because he is slightly more active.
Forestavia, Alistia, Parakka Northland
I have no direct objection, but I would like to hear the thoughts of some natives first.
Parakka Northland
*gasp*
I got votes? Wow.
Alistia, Malcholm, Parakka Northland
Welp, my phone no longer works. Got to go get a new phone tomorrow! FUN!
Malcholm, Terran Flux
Why happened to it?
My screen was having issues for the past month. It would flash randomly, noticeably when looking at a page with a white background. I was mid text message with someone and the screen just died. Everything works but something with the LEDs gave because my screen doesn't work.
Malcholm
My last phone, before my current, lasted about 3 or 4 years before it just died. Like, no charging, no nothing. Couldn't even turn it back on.
I remember forever ago Parakka Northland had to replace his Samsung note-7 or whatever it was called because they kept exploding
Alistia, New Bacon, Parakka Northland
Mine is 3 years old. Damn electronics!
Alistia, New Bacon
Yeah that tg was confusing and completely wrong!
Looks like oak is forcing this on us even though no one voted to merge those two positions...
Looks like Oakplumington has gone mad with power...
Maybe its time the whole government goes insane as well...
*Twitches*
Malcholm
I already tried the justice thing.
Fair.
Malcholm
Post self-deleted by Alistia.
Alright, also the poll for your office will be re-tabulated by the way. Why need to figure out what exactly is "Fire Chief" and whether or not we should keep it. Forest just threw it at us mindlessly.
Alistia
Well [nation=short]Parakka[/nation], here we go. The resistance begins. I thought it was good. We tried. Good luck next time you're Prime Minister. Even with the power of the founder behind you we still can't accomplish anything within a reasonable timeframe. I knew it was only a matter of time. Yessiree. So. Um. Now what?
Gyuamno, Alistia
I thought the merging of the positions was implied by the poll we voted on. Border, Domestic, Foreign affairs. Defense obviously gets merged with foreign affairs as regional defense is an issue that deals with foreign affairs by definition. This is so simple to me it's mind numbing. I'm really trying to figure out what all the blowback is about.
Gyuamno, Alistia, Parakka Northland
I've been forced to log onto Oak, forced not to use Oak for anything useful, banned, slandered, maligned. I can't figure out what you guys want! Give me a break!
*Chews Kit Kat bar*
Gyuamno, Alistia, Malcholm, Terran Flux, Parakka Northland
At least we all agree on the Embassy Protection Act. ;)
Gyuamno, Alistia, Malcholm
I BACK YOU 100% FOREST.
MAYBE YOU CAN RESTORE THE UNION, OTHERWISE, GYUAMNO REMAINS IN SECESSION!
Forestavia, Alistia, Terran Flux, Parakka Northland
It's good to have friends. I might secede with you as well comrade.
Gyuamno, Alistia
Mighty Oak I ask you to appoint me SUPREME SOVIET!
I WILL DRAIN THE SWAMP!
Alistia, Terran Flux
What the heck! What do I have to lose at this point? If they're gonna be mad at me for supposedly abusing my power let's make it a power abuse everyone will remember! Right?
Alistia
They even have the nerve to ban you! Corruption if you ask me! PULL THE PLUG!
Forestavia, Alistia, Terran Flux
The Soviet flag waves high today my dear Comrades! May this day relish in eternity as The Mystical Council has reached enlightenment!
Forestavia, Alistia, Terran Flux
There! I feel much better now.
Whose bright idea was it to found this region to begin with? They ought to be drawn and quartered!
Alistia, Malcholm, Terran Flux
You are in good hands my dear Oak, I will shine the light on the darkest abyss that has become our region!
Forestavia
I refuse to appeal that ban to the Lunar Council. Oak is happy to be part of a region certified most likely to....
Gyuamno, Alistia, Malcholm
Sometimes I think they're just trying to create more work for me. Let's ban him and make him waste another two months over in the back up region appealing another situation to the Court. And what was wrong with the other poll! Aren't we in agreement that we want to simplify the government? Abolish the fire chief position. It's straightforward. All you have to do is agree or disagree. If we as a region want to keep the position that's fine!
Good man, I am suspending polls! No need for this nonsense! We need to sort things out!
I'll give you polls after Alistia's poll is over. I am throwing Alistia a bone by letting that poll change slip. Besides, I've been wanting to do the Embassy thing for awhile now anyway. Gotta take your progress when you can get it, right?
Alistia
Indeed Comrade Oak, in the mean time - enjoy this great new tmc anthem!
https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=900173
Forestavia
To the dustbin with Cuba's anthem! We will now adopt Gyuamno's anthem for all time. This will be by Royal Decree!
Should we invite Misley over to join the party?
Gyuamno
DRAIN THE SWAMP! BIGLY! STRONKLY! YOLO!
Thank you Comrade! I have added great acoustic anthem too to listen at your leisure!
Forestavia
Assembled with Dot's Region Saver.
Written by Refuge Isle.