Post Archive
Region: The Confederacy of Free Nations
Yes, but the people being called out bring their guns, making one able bodied person owning a gun in interest of a well regulated militia
https://www.quora.com/What-do-the-terms-arms-well-regulated-and-militia-mean-in-the-Second-Amendment/answer/Peter-Mark-Ramirez?srid=vmNC
Not trying to start an argument. Just sorta saying. This is an issue I am very well read upon.
The United Providences Of Perland
But, the militia has the guns, not the individuals.
The militia has the right to own the guns, not the individual.
For all we know by the text, the Framers meant to say that guns will stay in a central place where the militia meets up.
Now, do you see the necessity to interpret constitutions as opposed to reading them face value? You clearly interpreted the Second Amendment, and didn't follow the exact text of it.
Also just in case you would like a second answer, this one also from Quora.
https://www.quora.com/What-do-the-terms-arms-well-regulated-and-militia-mean-in-the-Second-Amendment/answers/38336541?srid=vmNC
I don't need to interpret it, I can read a history book to tell how a militia worked in their time, therefor how they meant it. And you seem to think a militia is a hive mind.
Peng's Wise Words #4567:
Don't argue with gun-owners. They have the means to kill you(r argumentation).
Jaslandia, The United Providences Of Perland, Yukona
Tse is pretty much A+ in terms of knowledge here.
While I can see your argument, the Militia mentioned wouldn't include a central repository for the weaponry due to the large degree of hunting that went on; it would have been very difficult to separate a rifle meant for hunting from a rifle meant to murder considering how dangerous it was to hunt at all. Certainly, if they had meant for the creation of a repository then most of the Homesteaders who went west following the Louisiana-Purchase would have starved.
The United Providences Of Perland
In the richer colonies like Virginia they did have armories incase they got into real trouble, bust most of it was dedicated to ammunition and powder.
We seriously having a debate on constitutional interpretation?
Jaslandia, The United Providences Of Perland, Yukona
It appears so.
Jaslandia, Pirate Kingdoms
Well yeah, what if you have a ton of people who go hunting regularly? If they expend their GP and bullets than you won't really have much to fight on, but if there's a source for replacement guns and ammunition than you'll be fine enough. I suppose the difference is buried in how you deal with "Repository" there.
A repository wherein that is the [B]only[/B] place a gun may be procured is much different than a repository with spare, state-owned, weaponry.
I dunno, I literally just saw that we were talking about guns.
The United Providences Of Perland, Pirate Kingdoms
Huh: all this is happening and I'm just sitting here trying to modify MSL into less SL
The United Providences Of Perland
So, is a toy water gun considered a weapon in the US?
I mean it could be harmful to people if you shoot the jet of water right into someone's eye. And since the US seems to be a country where people are overprotective about everything I came up with that thought. An answer would be nice. :)
The United Providences Of Perland, Yukona
I have sorta been watching the convo all day, but when it moved into territory that I actually know about, I decided to pipe in with what I knew.
Jaslandia, Kalaron, The United Providences Of Perland
I mean, you could be charged with negligence or battery, but eh, it isn't really up to America's standards to be declared a weapon.
Penguania And Antarctica
Sorry for making you watch my monstrosity of a debate.
Yes and no. It is a toy. It can, like most things be used as a weapon if you really really want to.
For example: A baseball bat is sports equipment. Depending on your definition it is a toy. However baseball bats make really nice clubs, and have been used as weapons by both criminals, and law abiding citizens.
So a good way to look at it is that any object can be considered a weapon, if it is used as such. Make sense?
Penguania And Antarctica, The United Providences Of Perland
I was about to say that we don't consider them a threat, but these articles have stated otherwise :p
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/apr/19/alabama-girl-16-expelled-for-having-water-gun-at-s/
http://www.thecrimson.com/article/1992/6/27/super-soaker-squirt-weapon-spurs-boston/
http://gizmodo.com/crazy-japanese-inventor-builds-lethal-water-gun-1786614857 (this one is a maybe given a Japanese inventor constructor invented it)
https://www.popsugar.com/moms/Why-Kids-Shouldnt-Play-Water-Guns-43546916 (this one is also a maybe since it implies holding a water gun normalizes attitudes towards real guns)
Penguania And Antarctica
If it helps, I'm trying to find out if one of my totally insane idea would actually just blow up or if I'm on to something.
Results so far...kinda OK.
Pirate Kingdoms
I'm on the ball over here: I got free time to write but I can't decide to continue modifying UCT's Constitution, fixing San Fernando Valley's SL, fixing Chernarus's SL, continuing PK's overview, or continuing El-Aaiun's political overview
Yep. A little kid in Ohio was once shot by police in the chest because he was playing with a toy BB gun in a park.
Penguania And Antarctica, Yukona
This reminds me of the scene from American Dad where Roger, under his persona as Raphael Penguin, mentions to Francine that he's compelled by his employer to wear shoes that can't be used as a weapon. He throws one to Francine and says, "Try. It can't be done."
And then she proceeds to use it as a weapon against him.
I love Roger.
Jaslandia
I love Klaus. Such a little sadistic fish. Plus, he's German, which makes it even better.
Penguania And Antarctica
[nation=short]Continental_Commonwealths[/nation]
Sorry for not showing you my alternative format of a criminal code today. :(
Yukona
Are there any questions that I can answer?
I don't think Per should be doing most of the defending.
Penguania And Antarctica
Why is your constitution still linked on the WFE as the New Constitution? The spoiler doesn't change the fact that it's the only constitution listed there when people navigate to that page.
And why are the disqualified voter tallies still on the Election and Referendum page linked on the WFE? Especially when we consider that this is the same page voters are linked to in the text portion of the referendum, and it declares your constitution the winner.
Vista Major
I'm keep it there because I need that format for both constitutions, and it was too much effort at the time to go clearing it out.
As for the voter tallies, I simply hadn't thought about it until just now.
Then it shouldn't be featured on the WFE. You can keep it as a personal factbook, but it shouldn't be linked. Also, I would suggest adding "Draft" or something to its title, like I did for my Criminal Code.
I'm shown as the Minister of Justice and someone may look at my factbooks to get information about the region's law, so I put draft in its title so no one will mistake it as active policy.
That I also didn't think about. My mistake.
Eeeee, the issue I authored was just approved!
Now I've joined the hallowed halls alongside [nation=short]Nuremgard[/nation]. Although, he's authored, like, 70.
Nuremgard, Jaslandia, Penguania And Antarctica
[spoiler=For those curious souls]Carbon Emissions Are Why We Cant Have Nice Things
The Issue
Signing that international climate treaty all those months ago really put a feather in your cap, and in the cap of Continental Commonwealths. Stately banquets in Brancaland and numerous editorials on your progressive leadership; it really has been quite delightful. Today, however, a strongly worded letter from the treaty compliance commission arrived at your desk, asking you to detail how Continental Commonwealths plans to fulfill its obligations.
The Debate
Well, we always knew this day would come, laments renowned business tycoon Jamil Stevens. The important thing now is to ensure that the most business-friendly option is pursued. If we hook ourselves up to one of the established cap-and-trade systems, we can go shopping in the backwater signatory states and buy enough permits to allow Confederate companies to continue producing at their current rates. Our industry wont technically reduce their emissions, but its an international treaty, right?
Lets do this the right way, yes? suggests Natalie Brooks, avid yes-woman and resident of a territory completely devoid of oil and gas. If you want a tried and true method for reducing carbon emissions, you cant go wrong with a good old fashioned tax scheme. Yes, those territories with larger energy reserves and heavy industry will likely be impacted to a greater extent than those without, and socioeconomically its bound to be somewhat regressive, but we have to consider future generations. We can offset the damages by investing the revenue in renewable energy and social welfare, yes?
Theres another way, posits Balon Busk, the nations foremost newspaper columnist on technology and fantasy fiction. Carbon capture and storage technology has some great potential. Of course, kicking off new tech is always risky, so well need massive subsidies for investments in the right infrastructure and equipment. But if we get it to work, we wont need to reduce carbon emissions at all. Well just put it someplace it wont do any harm and no one is likely to stumble upon it, like deep below the Misty Mountains or something. Its the epitome of eating your cake and having it too! Expensive cake, but still.
This meddling in national affairs is sickening, howls Waylon Hawkins, an energy sector advocate known for his love of dramatic exaggerations. Any one of the proposed options will decimate our economy, without having the slightest positive impact on the environment, probably. All the worthwhile companies will flee to more business-friendly jurisdictions, and Continental Commonwealths will die a horrible and painful death; thats right, I said it: that treaty of yours will kill Continental Commonwealths. Whos going to appreciate all those flowers when everybodys dead, huh? Trash the treaty![/spoiler]
Nuremgard, Jaslandia, Vista Major, Penguania And Antarctica
I was the curious one, I was trying to find it in the issue section of the NS forums. I like it though.
Vista Major, Penguania And Antarctica
Nice one, Con!
Jaslandia, Vista Major, Penguania And Antarctica
Spitze!
Penguania And Antarctica
Oi, my response over in the RP region will be in multiple stages, is that fine with you? :P
Vista Major
Do your worst.
They're not animals that are itching for war, there's just a lot of background I have to explain before I get to Katerina's response.
Help what's going on
Redoing the Constitution referendum, which will have effects on the recent governmental election results if Unf's is chosen this time over Vista's.
Aside from that, in the RP world, Vista is turning his military against his own people which my leader called out and denounced. For some reason they're massing up their troops on their coasts as if we wanted to attack them too XD
Axeldonia, Oelesa
Friedensreich, Oelesa
''Tis my job as a socialist state that wants to spread the socialism! :P
Vista Major, Oelesa
Friedensreich, Oelesa
TBH its obvious that that amassment was just set up to deter people from entering or leaving the nation.
Vista Major, Oelesa
Erinnerst du? I said my favorite aspect of RPs are the politicking!
It should be pretty clear OOC what Katerina is trying to do at this point in time :P
Vista Major
Which proves Katerina's points that the Nordic Assembly is tyrannical true :P
Friedensreich
Oi, no need for hostility ye wicked wench!
Then why're you amassing troops, Frieds in Asia? What physical action is he going to do? Unless your troops are going to be physically catching his radio waves and flinging them in other directions lol
Fried is in Asia, however, Vista mobilizing troops on the coast isn't necessarily to keep people from entering or exiting.
It really depends on how alarmist Vista's nation is, tbh. They could easily take a separation attempt like what Fried is doing as a literal threat, and it isn't that far out there for a nation made almost entirely of coast to place more troops at the coast if they feel threatened. Furthermore, this seems more like reservist elements like the NG are being called to those bases more than anything (Why would Vista major not already have troops there otherwise?), and that isn't really super bad at all.
Tbh Vista is dealing with the possible threat of invasion as poorly as possible.
Not exactly trying to start a secessionist movement, but I guess if that turns out to be a side effect of what I'm trying to do, I won't complain.
No no, separation in that it's separating Vista Major from the International Community.
Friedensreich
You ever think people should pass a politics or intelligence test before being allowed to vote?
Short answer, yes
Long answer, Yes with extra steps
Nuremgard
Sadly, people in the US would just use it to exclude people from voting to win-and determination by intelligence violates the constitution here.
I just read some newspaper comments and despair. Although they do explain why the UK is so screwed.
determination kms. Discrimination*
That's the problem with democracy. Your vote and the moron's vote are considered equal.
The United Providences Of Perland
Post self-deleted by The United Providences Of Perland.
No. The dumb have every right to vote, even if they vote for failed businessman Cheetos.
The United Providences Of Perland, Yukona, Magnatronia
Better than no one being able to vote.
One side of me agrees with this. Another side says, "hell no they don't."
Eh. Democracy is so overrated as Frank in House of Cards says.
IC-wise, the Navy is looking for any reason to "secure the Democracy". OOC, ain't nobody gonna talk smack and expect me to do nothing physical
You wouldn't be entirely wrong
Naturally
Friedensreich
Hence my inclusion of "Long Answer: Yes with extra steps" Because that on its own is an awful idea
As I've said with Vidnoye my dear Vista, we only care about your IC reasoning, because thats how we get to screw with you the most ❤
Vista Major, Friedensreich
What extra steps?
Like Andy said, this is a purely IC situation, I hold no OOC resentment or anything of that nature towards you :P
Vista Major
Wait that was meant to be directed at [nation=short]The_United_Providences_of_Perland[/nation] but essentially things like the promotion of mass education from a non-bias standpoint, publishing of the tests and answers post-testing etc etc.
I'm all for pro-Meritocratic legislation, but only when its done right.
Nuremgard
Mess with the Nord, you get the sword
Neither do I
This is why I have an absolute monarchy in one of my other countries. The plebs don't know what's good for them.
Exactly, and that "Securing of the Democracy" is pretty dāmning, [nation=short]Vista_Major[/nation] have you started censoring media and the internet?
Vista Major
Eww
No, nor would we. The AVA was already pushing constitutional limits. Censoring media would mean a referendum, which would have to go to the public, and the public is none too happy with the Founders' Party (Grundare) right now.
It's efficient. One decider. No messing around with elections, referendums, debating or parliaments. Well, to an extent.
Vista Major
That democracy has been violated enough already, is there really anything left to secure? :PP
Vista Major, Andromitus
Because I don't know the extent of IC abilities, would you be (OOC) okay with me just not stopping a few rogue Andreallic citizens from maybe sorta hacking into a few public news systems in Vista Major? Hijacking a news broadcast or two, a few street billboards...
Vista Major
http://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/021/807/4d7.png
Vista Major
Culture, the democratic socialist economy, education and the universal welfare state, democracy itself
We're unstable; we just adopted a new constitution.
All news stations are public, obviously
*opens the proverbial IC door*
Andromitus
The vote is an absolutely intrinsic right that not even the government should have the ability to remove. Not allowing people with low IQs to vote means elitism and borderline thought police - besides, one does not have to be stupid if they don't pass an IQ test and the results can always be rigged.
[I]"Not stopping a few rogue Andreallic citizens"[/I], eh? Good cover up story.
I'd say the Social Contract is violated enough to say that the Nordic Assembly is no longer the government of Vista Major that rules with the consent of the people. But that's really just Katerina talking.
*Checks* Those people seem to own quite a bit of property, Fried, mistake me if I'm wrong but I think their being denied the Socialist paradise they were promised....
How about we go help with their "Democracy"
Yeah I know. I'm just being facetious and expressing my frustration with how democracy goes sometimes. E.g. Scottish independence, Brexit (even though I voted to Leave but regret it now), the election etc.
You think the Scottish Inderef was voted remain because of stupid people? Well then...
IQ tests are horribly indicators of intelligence anyway. That's why I flat out told my great aunt that was admitted into mensa a couple months back that she was joining probably the dumbest organization for smart people ever.
Yukona
That's what I mean lol. I'm just saying democracy annoys me sometimes because people vote differently from me, and that makes me bitter :P
There's a reason why great minds like Hawking aren't in MENSA and that's because they don't have to prove their intelligence by taking a complex crossword test or some bullsh*t of the like - they are smart by their accomplishments and inherent ability. If anything, MENSA is a label of insecurity, not intelligence.
Friedensreich
I don't like your views but I'd fight Timmy last dying breath to allow you to express them freely and with liberty
The view you dislike is my Scottish nationalism I presume?
I caught a mistake in your post:
Christian Hartford isn't the leader of the Assembly. We're a Presidential democracy, not Parliamentary.
If you want the leader of the Assembly, talk to the Chief Secretary
https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=829873
Friedensreich
Thanks. I'll take that post down in a bit and rectify it. I'm still packing up for Muskegon tomorrow (speaking of which, I'll be hard pressed to find good wifi there, so I might have to rely on cell service, which would make it harder for me to post or anything like that), so I'll get to that once I finish getting all that done.
Vista Major
Boatiful
"If you have to prove your worth to someone, you have already forgotten your value."
Nuremgard, Yukona
>fight Timmy last dying breath ayy lmao
And no, your views that Scotland should separate and your views against the English and the Union - but I'm a strong believer in self determination and the right to secede so I wouldn't really mind, but I'd be sad.
That's pretty much Scottish nationalism lol. I'd argue your use of language. "Separate" and "secede" imply we're a region trying to escape our rightful rulers. I simply want my country to regain its natural status as an independent nation once again.
But I doubt Scotland will ever leave the UK anyway. Stats show that most English people up here voted No the last time. As long as we have a permanent presence of English settlers, Scotland will never be independent. And that's not me being anti-English, that's me just being factual.
Ok, it's been edited. I changed leader to First Minister. Thanks again
Nuremgard, Vista Major
Yay for First Ministers! Well just mine. The others in the UK suck.
I hope we don't ever have a nationalist/secessionist movement again here in the US. That'd just be a nightmare... Well, another nightmare done again.
I doubt it. At least all you guys over there can get behind being American and also being proud of being from certain states. I cannot get behind being British and many others up here cant. So if Scotland remains in the UK, I'm always going to feel alienated by the British political system and British identity in general.
Gg
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Written by Refuge Isle.